1 50 9 https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/d9fcb0fcb4469f2fbaa250a9deeaeb01.pdf 648b9d4bac1ab80bbcd4a2b3528a0465 PDF Text Text Name: Branch: Years Served: Date of Interview: Lieutenant Lyndon Bartlett U.S. Air Force 2009- present October 13, 2012 Seth Chesson: Alright my name is Seth Chesson and I am here with First Lieutenant Lyndon Bartlett. The date is October 13, we are in First Lieutenant Bartlett’s home and I am conducting an interview for an oral history project for Professor Brownings class. First Lieutenant Bartlett, I would like to ask you where you received your training to be an officer in the Air Force? Lyndon Bartlett: I graduated Air Force academy class of 2009.Colorado Springs. Chesson: And as an academy graduate have you noticed any prejudice toward or against you by other officers or enlisted personnelsince you’ve been in the military? Bartlett: Yes, if you work with academy grads and commanders you know it just depends if your boss is a grad or not. There’s definitely a good ol’ boy network between the USAFA grads. But other than that…there’s some good, good natured ripping you could say between ROTC guys and USAFA guys but the mutual respect is within everybody so no, no real prejudice, just you know, friendly competition. CHESSON: So have you had any commanders who were academy graduates who you noticed favored you more or gave you more praise or gave you more awards or anything? BARTLETT: No, no, not at all, not at all. There’s…my commander now is a grad and the commander I had before was not. There’s no…any good commander not gonna show favoritism from your commissioning scores. CHESSON: And How long have you been with the Air Force? BARTLETT: 3 years. CHESSON: 3 years.. BARTLETT: 4 years reserve 3 years active duty CHESSON: And you’re...are you currently looking towards a career or serving out your 8…your term? 1 �BARTLETT: I’d like to do career. Everybody…I mean its always good to plan to do a career and if something happens along the way you can get out. You should always practice like you’re going to be in the game for the long haul. CHESSON: Lets see…and…what do you currently do? When you graduated from the academy…well I guess what I shouId ask is when you graduated from the academy did your plan to do change from what you are actually doing or did you….is your job reflective of what you went to the academy to do? BARTLETT: Definitely. When I was a junior at the academy I..I lost my pilots license. They…the goal at the academy wasto be a pilot. That’s why you go to the Air Force academy because you do get favoritism as to who gets the pilot slots. They go to the academy first, so that’s why I went there. And then junior year I found out that I was born with a particular condition which is disqualifying for pilots in the Air Force. So that was pretty rough, there was a little cynicism on my part after that…but once I actually got out and I got my…I’m in cyber warfare that’s my actual career field, once I found out that career…once I got that and found out what it was actually about and the leadership aspects to the job and how many people you get to supervise and all that stuff it was….I really enjoyed it a lot. CHESSON: And cyber warfare, what exactly does that mean? I mean sounds pretty cool but what exactly does that kinda job entail? BARTLETT: There’s two branches, one branch is….is…either you have attack and defense….there’s one branch, the ASHRED, that is network defense, intrusion detection, aggression against enemies. So like China or…other 3rd party organizations in the Middle East. And then there’s the other half, the BSHRED, which is what I do, which is more leadership oriented. You’llmanage a squad at the base level, which for the Army equates to like Company leadership. CHESSON: And I’ll backtrack a little bit before to what you said before about wanting to be a pilot. So you originally went to the academy to become a pilot but when you were back in high school your main drive, like what I guess I should say like whendid you decide in your younger years that you wanted tobe an Air Force pilot and the academy was your goal. BARTLETT: Well everybody wants to be like astronauts or whatever when they are kids so I wanted to be a fighter pilot. So my dad was a pilot and that got me interested in aviation so that’s how I got the dream as a kid and then the Air Force Academy seemed like the best way for me to do that so it wasn’t necessarily that I wanted to be an Air Force pilot it just…the Air Force Academy, they produced the most pilots per capita, so that’s where I wanted to go and get a pilots license out of there. 2 �CHESSON: And was your dad in the Air Force as well? BARTLETT: No, not at all. Dad was a US airways pilot, he actually never went military at all so he was civilian all the way through. CHESSON: So the military was basically just an avenue for you to become a pilot not necessarily… a means to an end as opposed to a final destination. BARTLETT: Correct….Correct. But they always say in the military you join for one reason and you stay for another. So I defiantly joined for…you know…the whole cool aspect of being a pilot but I stayed for other reasons which is what I found out…you know the stability of the job, the prestige of it, you get good training, you get to work with good people, you get good leadership opportunities that are varying…you know I mean I was in charge of 45 people when I was 24 so that’s pretty rare not a lot of guys get to do that. So that’s why I stayed in and I really started to enjoy it. CHESSON: So you definitely noticed and improvement in your…well I guess…you know….your quality of life and your…you know…perception of self since you’ve been in the military? BARTLETT: Definitely, definitely. And I guess the military’s kinda like a microcosm if you will…it’s like the whole society you know you got different jobs. There’s support jobs, there’s operational jobs, and then there’s people…you know there’s real fast burners and then there’s guys that are just in there to punch their tickets every day. So its just interesting…you can see kinda all that within one military unit. You get a larger leadership experience through that avenue then you could…and you get a lot….you get that leadership experience a lot faster and you get a lot more of it at a very young age rather than at a….is the phone working alright? Than…rather than at a civilian job. CHESSON: …Lets see, and…so would…your cyber warfare, I’ll jump back to your current job…are you…is that a field….you said your with the BSHRED more of the leadership component….is that a job that you could see yourself staying in and progressing towards…you know if you stay career… you know becoming a Colonel or a General within that field or would you like to think of… you know switching up your branch and… you know joining some different avenue within the Air Force? BARTLETT: In the Air Force that’s pretty rare, you rarely switch branches, so yeah that’s definitely somewhere I could see myself doing. The ASHRED, probably not my style, I’ve never been a huge tech, you know, I’ve never been really into computer programing and the 3 �ASHREDS, they do some pretty high speed stuff, they do a lot of top secret crap. They do a lot of stuff they can’treally talk about but they also work in cubicles their entire career and all they do is look at codes so I mean, it’s really cool… CHESSON: And in BSHRED, would you get to go into a field environment in any point in time? BARTLETT: Yeah, yeah definitely that’s what you do in BSHRED. It’s a lot more leadership, you know, you deal with people a lot more, it’s not necessarily as technical as the ASHRED but I like the leadership and the people aspect of it I think that’s what I’m good at so that probably where I’ll stay. CHESSON: So during a deployment, what would you think that your day to day job would be as a BSHRED First Lieutenant your , you know, your daily task in Afghanistan or Pakistan or something would be? BARTLETT: Well there’s literally dozens of different jobs especially as, I mean I’m a First Lieutenant and that’s O2, in the Air Force, so as a First Lieutenantthere’s like dozens of different jobs so you could either be at a base, a large base managing a communications squadron or you could be at a FOB somewhere, forward operating base, I don’t know if you guys use that same terminology, you could be at a forward operating base living in tents and stuff just managing a radio tower or a satellite link. You could, they have, you know, airborne units that go and deploy to certain areas, they have that aspect of the job. So there’s all sorts of different jobs you could do when your deployed. It’s like anything, there’s literally a vast array of jobs in a certain career field that are, you know, there’s lame ones and there’s good ones. CHESSON: And you promoted fairly quickly upon graduating from the academy from Second to First Lieutenant, you know, you’ve only been in for three years, and are you upcoming for another promotion now pretty soon? BARTLETT: Yeah, just got selected for Captain, so that was good. CHESSON: And what entails you getting into that next rank. BARTLETT: Okay well the way it works is you submit, it’s all based on reports, so you submit a form, a promotion recommendation form that has the nine best, you get nine lines on this form to describe the nine best things you’ve done in your previous career and that’s all you get and all those, everybody does the exact same thing and a board of really high speed higher ranking guys looks at them all and ranks everybody in order and the top, for captain its almost impossible to not make it so like the top 92% of guys get picked. 4 �CHESSON: So would you say that going from O1 of Second Lieutenant to Captain is pretty easy for new officers? BARTLETT: Well Second Lieutenant to First Lieutenant is automatic. There’s no evaluation at all. If you’re alive you make it. And First Lieutenant to Captain is selective but it’s not, it’s a high selection percentage. Then the first rank that really is competitive is Major, which is about half the guys get selected. CHESSON: And you said you know the 9 best attributes of you getting selected. What would you say…well like…what would you put on your Captain recommend…your Captains sheet so that people could look at you and be like This is…Lieutenant Lyndon Bartlett and he’s done this. What would you say your best qualities are? BARTLETT: ….Well usually its job centric. I don’t know how specific you wanna get there’s 3 categories on that form. There’s 3 blocks that the General in charge of your entire major command can award you. So there’s do not promote, which if you get that block checked you mean you either like murdered somebody or you got a DUI or something so the general is saying do promote this guy. Very rarely does that happen unless you really jacked up. Then there’s promote, which goes to 90% of people. Promote, if you’re in that category, that’s when you have to put the 9 bullets on, and that’s the competitive category. And then you get do not…and then you get defiantly promote, which if…if the top ten percent of your rank category if you get selected do not promote then your promotion form is blank and you make it automatically. So that was what I got so I didn’t have to put anything on there and actually like for me it was automatic. But you normally would have to put the 9 lines on there that was just a normal… CHESSON: Well I guess when I asked about the 9 lines…What would you have said to make yourself stand out from other…. BARTLETT: Ohh, well the things that make you promote are stratification so if you get selected for number one of…everything in the Air Force is ranked…or is…stratified, meaning if you are working with 5 guys you wanna be the number one of 5 guys. Or if you’re working with 20 people you wanna be the number or if there’s…you know…and there’s different levels so you could be ranked as the number one Lieutenant on the entire base, the number one Lieutenant in your squadron or whatever. So that’s one thing you defiantlywanna put on there. So if you’re good enough to get stratified by your bosses you put that on there ok? What?…(speaking to someone off record)…Ok so if I would have had to put 9 lines on there I got selected as number one Lieutenant on the base last year so I would have put that on there as like the biggest one, first one on there. 5 �CHESSON: You won, you won the…is that just with the Lieutenants or with all officers on the base? BARTLETT: No they do it in grade categories. So Second Lieutenant First Lieutenant are grouped into one category. CHESSON: So… BARTLETT: So out of all the Lieutenants on base… CHESSON: That’s probably pretty…a lot because its O1. BARTLETT: Right, or O2. O1 O2 together. There are a lot. But you compete at the Squadron level, which is Company for Army. You compete at the Company level, if you win that you go to the…Battalion level, which for us is called a Group. And if you win that you go to the Wing level which for you is Regiment. CHESSON: Regiment or Division, or I guess Brigade is technically above Battalion. BARTLETT: Yea our base wasn’t big enough to have a Brigade level, it was just a Wing for us. So you put that stuff on there and again if you won any awards, if you do things, you always wanna put stuff like that on there. So if you’ve done really well that year and you get a yearly award you put that on there. If you’ve done…if you’ve completed some really large base wide project like if you’ve…if you were in charge of this section you guys…and your guys got like maintenance unit of the year you wanna put that on there. Anything that shows your leadership is…is above and beyond the normal call of duty is what you wanna put that on there. And that’s what their looking for to see. CHESSON: What kinda..you know….special….like talking about special stuff that units have done…what kinda specialty schools or special programs…has your unit or yourself been selected to go into? BARTLETT: My unit..its…officers and enlisted have a lot…have very different training regimens. So enlisted do very…they do lots and lots of training over a long period of time because its…as enlisted person your expected to be an expert in your particular field and know the ins and outs and all the very specific regulations that are…that that entails. As an officer you’re not expected to know that. You’re expected to be a good leader, lead by example, but you’re also supposed to have a very broad knowledge of everything rather than have a deep knowledge of one area. So our training is very….is very…OJT oriented. By that I mean on the job training. So usually you just go shadow people….I did a 6 month tech school training when I 6 �first got out but that was kinda just a box checker thing. For the most part when you first come into the units as a Second Lieutenant you’ll have a whole bunch of jobs in succession. So you will do every shop in the unit you’ll go and rotate through and spend a couple of months in that shop so you can get a large breadth of experience in a very short period of time. So that way when it comes time for you to be a commander of that unit you have at least some knowledge of the workings of that area. CHESSON: So…you know…you’ve done…mostly what you’re saying is that you’ve got, you know, a lot of…mostly I guess you’re in more of a management position, you know, guiding your enlisted personnel who are trained specifically for the job and you’re just kinda there to supervise, refine, and make plans and stuff. BARTLETT: Absolutely, and that’s the same for any officer in any career field, especially in the Army. The Army is huge about that so…in fact you would be looked down upon if you tried to do an enlisted job because they would get…you would offend not only the chief of that section but you would offend that Airman or that Soldier because you’re saying to them I can do this job better than you even though you’re highly trained in that area, so yes, you’re supposed to manage the team, make sure they have their resources that they need, make sure they have the training that they need and the manning that they need and get out of their hair and make sure they’re staying on task. CHESSON: would you say that you’re pretty successful in doing that with your…do you work with many enlisted personnel? BARTLETT: Yeah my flight had 45 people, so that’s pretty average. CHESSON: Average…that’s about the size of an infantry platoon, about 44 BARTLETT: Yeah, yeah platoon leader…so exactly, that’s what I was, its occasionally rare for Lieutenants to do that but Lieutenants and Captains are usually platoon leaders…or flight leaders for us, flight chiefs. CHESSON: Did you notice as a, you know, working closely with the, did you work very closely with the enlisted personnel when you were a flight leader? BARTLETT: I had four senior NCO’s that worked right under me, and with those people I worked very closely with. But other than that I tried to stay out of their hair. If they were performing to par, I usually stay out of their hair and tried to take care of their people and make sure they were getting awards put in for them and taking care of patted on the back and there was one section… 7 �CHESSON: Tell them what to do not how to do it kind of thing? BARTLETT: Exactly, exactly. And they know what to do, usually they know what to do way better than I did cause I was so new and so fresh, I was just kinda there not to jack anything up. So I did have a problem with one section and, you know, then I had to get in their business a little bit. CHESSON: Do you want to go into that at all or is that kind of a private… BARTLETT: Okay, yeah sure, there was…its not private, there was one section that, when you first enter the Air Force as an enlisted person you take what’s called the ASVAB and I think you do that for the Army too…so when you do that you get branched out into a certain career field and there’s certain career fields that are harder to get into than others that require higher aptitude…well there’s one part of commof the enlisted version of communications where it’s a very low aptitude career field. It’s called knowledge operations. And all they do is manage records for the whole base, they just manage these large warehouses and its extremely boring and its one of the lowest aptitude jobs in the Air Force,it’salmost as low as cook. So, know, inherently by that you know that you’re probably going to have more problems with that section than with another section because you have lower aptitude folks that have less drive that don’t want to perform as high and that usually don’t get held to as high of a standard as everybody else. So the challenge is you have to motivate them either by the carrot or the stick to still perform well up to that hard level so I ended up having to, you know, punish several people, give out paper work, that sort of thing to certain people. We would have credit card issues, credit card fraud, poor financial management, there’s one guy that’s beating his wife, there’s a lot of personality issues that go on that you have to deal with as an officer that, you know, you’re kind of supposed to be the bad guy in that situation for that kind of an issue. That kind of stuff we had to nip in the bud pretty quick it was getting pretty bad reputation for that section in the unit so that was one of the challenges is dealing with that where you don’t want to crush the moral of the section but you want to find the people that are not performing and get them out as quickly as possible. CHESSON: And I guess as an officer you kind of, you know, have to look at it and like you said, kind of be the bad guy but at the same time you have to be the person that they look up to…you know…how difficult is that being the inspiration but at the same time being the disciplinarian? BARTLETT: Well if you’re tough but fair, they will always…they’ll be pissed at first, it doesn’t matter how mad they are, if you’re tough but you are equally tough to every single person, people will respect you, and there’s nothing they can say…as long as you’re doing the 8 �same thing…if someone shows up late to work and you hammer them with paperwork, and someone that you really like shows up late to work you better be hammering them with paperwork the exact same way or else you’re gonna have the look of favoritism. So as long as you avoid that and everybody knows that you’re dealing with the regulation, you’re following the rules, you’re not trying to make up stuff on your own, you’re not favoring one section over the other its usually okay, and they understand who the dirt bags are, some guys show up late to work four times every month, that’s a problem, and he knows, and even he knows that was wrong, everybody has a basic understanding of right and wrong and they’ll be pissed at first but, you know, you just, you do what’s necessary and you keep on rolling and that’s their problem, you know? You’re not there to make friends with anybody, you just…. CHESSON: Yeah, you’re there to do a job… BARTLETT: Exactly… CHESSON: And are you, you know, kinda switching gears a bit…are you looking at deployment any time soon? Or.. BARTLETT: The position I’m in now, I’m actually an instructor at the citadel so that’s a special duties assignment for me and its non-deployable, so no…I was slated for deployment last December but I ended up getting this citadel job instead which over took that deployment. So…for the rest of the year that I’m at this job I’m not deployable but I’ll probably get hit with a deployment soon after I get to my next job. CHESSON: And, you know, you enjoy…so basically at the citadel you would be a..kind of on par with a college professor. BARTLETT: Yea that’s what I am I’m a college instructor, I teach Air Force cadets. CHESSON: And as an Air Force…do you feel, I guess, well trained for that job? You feel like you, as an academy graduate, you have the appropriate knowledge to go in and teach other Air Force… potential Air Force cadets and potential Lieutenants to come in and do the job that you are doing now or do you feel like all the training you received has kind of not prepared you adequately for that? BARTLETT: Well, I mean I don’t know if I personally am a great teacher but I know that they train you pretty well. They make it pretty easy for you, the guys who send down the curriculum make it pretty straight forward, you just follow the certain…a certain set of objectives, you make sure you hit some certain points, and the rest of it is down to personal teaching style but as long 9 �as you care about it and they know you care I think you probably came across the best that you should. And a lot of its hands on learning so you can’t really mess that up, you know? CHESSON: Awesome, well it is great talking to you Lieutenant Bartlett and thank you very much for participating in our interview. BARTLETT: Perfect, glad to do it. 10 � https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/aa704530f5998f247e969c49c0f22512.mp3 37166991d96fc47c45387f62072df08c Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Appalachian State University American Military History Course Veterans Oral History Project Description An account of the resource Each semester, the students of the American Military History Course at Appalachian State University conduct interviews with military veterans and record their military experiences in order to create an archive of oral history interviews that are publicly accessible to researchers. The oral histories are permanently available in the Appalachian State University Special Collections. The project is supervised by Dr. Judkin Browning, Associate Professor of History at Appalachian State University and all interviews are transcribed by the student interviewers. Copyright Notice: Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project’s audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used (e.g. Veterans Oral History Project, University Archives and Records, Special Collections, Appalachian State University, Boone, NC). Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. File size 63.4 KB 39.2 MB Format, digital MP3 Military Branch military branch (U.S. Army, etc) U.S. Air Force Officer Rank Officer rank (major, private, etc) Lieutenant Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Chesson; Seth Bartlett; Lyndon Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview. Chesson, Seth Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed. Bartlett, Lyndon Interview Date 10/13/2012 Number of pages 10 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 0:21:25 Date digitized 1/2/2015 Checksum alphanumeric code bd89f39cb4ecaa1279fda968b737410c 37166991d96fc47c45387f62072df08c Scanned by Leah McManus Equipment Adobe Acrobat XI Pro Resolution 300 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project's audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal; non-commercial; and educational use; provided that proper citation is used. Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived UA.5018. American Military History Course Records Recording rate A/V rate (48,000kzh x 16 bit) 48000kzh x 16 bit Format, original Electronic File Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 5018_Bartlett_Lyndon_20121013_transcript_A 5018_Bartlett_Lyndon_20121013_audio_A Title A name given to the resource Interview with Lieutenant Lyndon Bartlett [October 13, 2012] Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Language A language of the resource English English Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a title="UA.5018. American Military History Course Records" href="https://appstate-speccoll.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/167" target="_blank">UA.5018. American Military History Course Records</a> Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Bartlett, Lyndon Chesson, Seth Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project's audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used. Description An account of the resource First Lieutenant Lyndon Bartlett went into the Air Force because he wanted to be a pilot like his father who worked for US Airways. Due to a physical defect, he couldn't continue flying planes, but he went into BSHRED cyber warfare which he describes as very leadership oriented. He plans to make a career in the military. Subject The topic of the resource Bartlett, Lyndon Veterans Cyberspace operations United States Interviews Military Science Air Force BSHRED Colorado Springs cyber warfare First Lieutenant https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/040ead966d7e44a1c7d22ff29a0f17e4.pdf 3c0b346aae56c7becea1d214868faf3b PDF Text Text Name: Branch: Years Served: Conflicts: Date of Interview: Patrick McGarrell, Airman 2nd class Naval Reserve/Air Force 1954-1959 Cold War October 12, 2012 David Broome: Alright, my name is David Broome I am sitting in Concord, North Carolina with a Mr. Patrick McGarell. We are located in his house like I said in Concord, North Carolina on Oct 12 2012 and I’d like to thank mr mcgarell for allowing me to have his time and allowing me to ask him about his military experience. And Mr McGarrell if you could state your name for the record Patrick McGarrell: Patrick B. McGarrell Broome: Okay, thank you sir. And what branch of the military were you in? McGarrell: Well originally I put in 14 15 months in Naval Reserve and then enlisted in the Air Force. Broome: Okay, is there any particular reason why you changed from…? McGarrell: Oh yes, I joined the Naval Reserve just to make some extra money. But when I came ready to join, I did not want to go in the navy. I debated between army and Air Force…and when it came down to the last minute I went Air Force. Broome: Alright, sir. Also, can I get you to state your date of birth for the record? I should have asked you that previously McGarrell: December 31, 1936 Broome: Okay, sir so you said… for the naval reserve you joined to make some money, was there any other reason behind it initially? McGarrell: No, no. Broome: You were just in for it for the money? McGarrell: That was the easiest way to make some extra money. Broome: Okay, alright. And you said you did not want to be in the navy? McGarrell: Right. Broome: Is there any particular reason why you chose not to? Mc Garrell: I just didn’t want to. BroomeYou just didn’t want to..? 1 �McGarrell: I’d gone through a little bit of the navy, two weeks basic training. Broome: Uh hmm. McGarrell: I saw it, I just didn’t want to do it. Broome: How was the basic training of the navy compared to the basic training of the air force which you eventually chose? McGarrell: Just different… In the air force if you kept your nose clean and just did what they told you to, there was no problems. As one of our DIs, or TIs as they called them in the air force Boy scout camp was harder than the air force basic Broome: Really? Did they really say that or did you just..? McGarrell: Yeah, yeah. Broome:Alright, so you ended up joining the air force …and once you initially joined the air force, what did you..what role were you? McGarrell: In basic training Broome: You were just in basic training? McGarrell: Yeah, in Lackland, Texas. Lackland Air Force Base at San Antonio, Texas… Broome: Okay. McGarrell: Back when I went in, every male had a 8 year military obligation. It could be served in several different…so much active duty, so much reserve duty or joining the national guard and put in 6 months and then so many years. And,.. this was the easiest way to do it. Broome: Do you know what year it was…you immediately joined? McGarrell: I joined the naval reserve in jan of 1954 and enlisted in the air force in april or may of 1955. Broome: You said it was 1955, sir? McGarrell: Yeah. Broome: Okay. Alright, so you started..you joined the naval reserve because you wanted some extra money and after basic…basic training, you decided you wanted to join the air force and you said basically that the air force seemed to be easier than boy scout camp. Do I have you right there? McGarrell:Yes, yeah. Broome: Okay, well once you joined the air force, what was your..primary duty for …what was your role? McGarrell: Okay, okay 2 �Broome: Did you work radios or did you..? McGarrell: Okay, after we got out of basic training, everybody was supposed to go to some kind of school. They sent me to prelanguage school,…which was where you went through the entire English language in t30 days. You had to take a test every day and they had a 97 …98 percent washout rate on it. They had no business sending me to that school. I graduated from high school with…C average in English. But they had to have so many bodies in that school so…When I got out, washed out, went back to Lackland Air Force Base for reclassification, went through the procedure again and they sent me to Air Police School in California… They called it air police school in fact, Air Base Defense…And there was some police training in it, most of it was infantry training: learning how to provide security for…air force base you know, infantry in case we were attacked, all that good stuff. Broome: Okay…Do you remember any particulars how ..your training for Air Base Defense was different than your basic training? McGarrell: Oh, yeah…you had all kinds of weapons training …and.. in Air Force Basic training the only basic training you had was with something called a carbine. Which is a World War II type weapon, not much more than a .22, but in Air Police School, or Air Base Defense, we trained with the M1 rifle, which was the…standard weapon of.. military really at the time. And the Browning Automatic Rifle, we trained with ….45 pistol, a ....little .45 caliber machine gun called the “grease gun”, and a .30 caliber ground machine gun…Then they demonstrated mortars to us, which we would never fire, but they demonstrated that they were in.. arsenal. Broome: Okay. So they were in arsenal but you never really..they kind of demonstrate them but you never really had hands on experience with them? McGarrell: Oh, right. Broome:..How, just out of curiosity, I’m assuming it being military that they would take this training very seriously. McGarrell: Oh, yes. Broome: Did they? McGarrell: Oh, yes. Broome: So, it was definitely a step up compared to Air Force Basic training. McGarrell: Oh yes, and the reasoning for all this was during the Korean War they had a bunch of air police killed guarding an air base, where they weren’t trained to..you know…fight like that. You know they were..and the Air Force was responsible back then for its own security of their own air base. Previously, when it was part of the army, the army was the security. But when the air force became a separate military service, the air force became responsible for its own security. Broome: Do you think that was the right move by the air force? McGarrell: Oh yes, oh yes. 3 �Broome: Let me ask you this, I know you said, you said it several times now that I’ve gone through it that the basic training for the air force was rather lax.. McGarrell: No, it wasn’t lax. It wasn’t as physical as you’d have in the army, specially marine corps, something like …it was more mental training. Broome: Do you, hypothetically…Do you think that the lack of physical training would have contributed to all the Korean incidents that you noted? You don’t think that was it, you think it was just planning and things of those nature? McGarrell: No, lack of the infantry type training Broome: In regards to the mental training, what did they have you exactly do? Like, what was the training like? McGarrell: Classes, most of the time. You just would do some marching, a little PT, but a majority was sitting in classes. Broome: Alright, so it was more like…like a school type setting? McGarrell:Yeah, yeah. Broome: Okay…So after you left the prelanguage school, and.. you did they tell you to go there? Did they just send you off? McGarrell: Oh, yeah. Broome: Did you choose to go there…? McGarrell: No, I didn’t choose it they just said where you were going. That’s the way the military does it. Broome: Yeah, so you get no say so, it’s just you’re basically going to do this? McGarrell: Right, yeah. Broome: Did you express any interest in that at all or..? McGarrell: No. Broome: And this prelanguage school..what did…what was the goal of it so that people that graduated from it would do..? McGarrell:…If you made it through that you were sent to several of..there were several colleges/universities around the country where you would learn.. you can learn Chinese, Russian, all these so called..so called enemies of the time where you become an interpreter and analyst. Broome: Do you wish you had gone that route in hindsight? McGarrell: No, nah. 4 �Broome: Is there any particular reason why? McGarrell: Just had no interest, ya know. Broome: And you said most..you said there was a washout rate I believe of 97..98 percent. Do you believe there was enough public education prior to this? McGarrell: Oh, yeah. It was just a ..tough…It was just …so…tough. Broome: It was just very tough? McGarrell: We had one guy in the class, there. He had a …he was an English graduate, that’s what his degree was in .. Broome: Oh, wow. McGarrell: It was just a extremely… rigorous course. I don’t know if you’ll call it a course…or if you’ll call it an elimination round. Broome: Well, after you went through the…elimination round…were you proud about becoming part of the Air Base Defense? McGarrell: Glad or not, I do not know. It was just a school they assigned me to to go to. Broome: Do you remember any of the other options for schools around this time period? McGarrell: Back then, there was everything that was open. I don’t remember..ya know? Broome: You don’t remember it? McGarrell: I know one guy though, when we go to…school in California, one guy was very upset about it. He didn’t wanna be no policeman. He didn’t wanna shoot anybody…His father knew some politician and he was from Colorado. His father knew somebody who knew somebody who got in touch with somebody in Washington. Next thing we know he had orders to go to weather school… So, you could get out if it, you know, but I didn’t know anybody. Broome: So, you didn’t have any connections so that you could get out of it? McGarrell: Nah, no. Broome: How many people do you think tried to get out of it? McGarrell: He’s the only one that I know of. Broome: And it was simply because he simply didn’t like that assignment or because he didn’t like the whole idea of it really? McGarrell: Well, the whole idea of it really. He wanted to learn something else. Broome: Was there…so he was ready join and serve and everything but he did not want to join that particular school for air base defense, correct? 5 �McGarrell: Who him? Yeah. Broome: And you didn’t have any strings you could pull to get out of it? McGarrell: Nah. Broome: If you had a string to pull to get out of it, would you have? McGarrell: Looking back on it, I believe I would have, but that’s from hindsight. At the time, maybe I was too dumb to…use any strings. Broome: Alright, so …we’ll go back to your little story of your life here. After you get through the air base defense school, for lack of a better term, what happened then? McGarrell: I was…I went to Keflavik Air Force Base in Iceland. Broome: Okay, how long were you stationed in Iceland, sir? McGarrell: One year…and I went there by choice. Broome: Is there any particular reason you chose that base? McGarrell: Well when …I was finished up class…in Air Police School/Air Base Defense School the top ten percent in the class got their choice based on first, second, third. Anything was open in the world. We knew we were all going overseas…I was either second or third on the list ..I knew I did not want to go to the Far East, I would have been shipped out of the base I was on, that was a three year tour. I did no want to go to Europe for three years, so I saw this list…Who ever heard of anybody going to Iceland? Since it was a one year tour, I said I’d take that one…And Iceland sounds bad but it wasn’t that bad. It’s on the Artic Circle, but it really doesn’t get that cold…Coldest I saw it was in a year’s time, fifteen above zero. The warmest I saw it was five above zero, but it felt hot…and that’s because the Gulf Stream swings up around there, just enough to offset the temperature coming from the Artic Circle…ya know. We had snow, but we didn’t have that bad a snow. Course I do remember seeing icebergs floating. Back from our barrack you could see the ocean…I remember seeing the icebergs floating out there but, ya know didn’t think anything about it…And there’s plenty of people that live in Iceland, civilian population up there. Broome: You know what, let me ask you this, where were…I should have asked you this earlier. Where were you born? McGarrell: Roanoke, Virginia Broome: Roanoke, Virginia. So, ..the climate of Iceland was a little different than that of Virginia McGarrell: Oh yes.To show ya the difference, we got on a plane out.. of McGuire Air Force Base in New Jersey. We just had regular airforce clothes on. Some people flying out of there to Greenland which is maybe 800 900miles west of Iceland on the same latitude, longitude, whatever that is, they could not get on a plane if they did not have Artic survival gear on..with them. Now, that’s the different in those two places not that far apart. 6 �Broome: Wow…Do you have any training prior to joining…prior to joining Iceland being in the Artic like you said? McGarrell: No, nah. Broome: I know you said in one year you were obligated to serve one year…Do you wish you had gone in hindsight the European route or the Asian route? McGarrell: Nah, no. Although, I have learned later that Bermuda was on the list. Course, that would have been a three year. We had an air base in Bermuda. I thought maybe..maybe..but ya know. The way things have worked out because I went to Iceland…met an airman there who had his high school annual and things…that’s why I’m here today, that’s why you’re here today..ya know… Broome: Alright. McGarrell: Things have a way of working out in life, ya know. If you..You trace…If you can all trace it back to some point in your life when you get old enough, you trace it all down to why you there..and where you are today. Broome: Uh Hmm. Alright, so you were in Iceland a year. Do you know your rank at this point? McGarrell:I went up there as an airman 3rd and got promoted airman 2nd after I’d been there…56 months. Broome: Do you feel like it was easy to move through the ranks or it wasn’t? McGarrell: Well…The first promotion was…but in the air police field, once you got the airman 2nd it was hard to get the airman1st because there weren’t that many openings. They would give so many openings per promotion cycle..which was every quarter for career fields. Mechanics, jet mechanics…stuff like that…they could get promoted real quick. You could make staff sergeant in two years…When I got out, let’s see…when I got out…I had 30-something months in grade for promotion. I was airman2nd and there’s very little chance of getting promoted Broome: Do you ever feel bad that it was harder for you to get promoted or? McGarrell: Oh , yes, money. Broome: Yeah, because of course with the extra… McGarrell: Not that great of money, but money. A difference every month.. Broome: Right, yeah. So the money appealed more than the actual having prestiege. McGarrell: Yeah, I mean we all did the same thing. Broome: Okay, so you said that…It was mainly based on the money and that they basically you would have liked to be promoted would you have not? McGarrell: Oh yes. 7 �Broome: …But that it was easier…It would have been easier to join another field if say you were just in it for a promotion, like some people may have hypothetically been. McGarrell: Alright, so...But now here’s the kicker, when I got to Iceland, a bunch of them said,”Any of yall know how to type? I raised my hand. I had some experience on a typewriter. They said, “We need a clerk in the Provost Marshal’s office, are you interested?” I said yeah, I’ll go there. The Provost Marshal office is the head of the air force police squadron. More or less the chief of police of the base. They need somebody to type security clearances there. That’s what I did for about eight months, sitting in an office typing security clearances. Broome: Did you like the office environment? McGarrell: Yeah. Broome: Or would you have rather been more outside? McGarrell: It was the military I worked the day shift five days a week. If I had been on the air police still I’d be working rotating shifts that rotated every month. After I got…after I had maybe been doing that eight months or nine months that after I got back to the states I wouldn’t be doing that. I better go on regular police duty and found out what I’m supposed to do out there…So, I did that about three months. Broome: Then this three months was the regular…for lack of a better word. McGarrell:Guarding airplanes..working a gate every once in a while. Broome: Okay. So after you had the eight months as a clerk and the three months after being with the air police..being outside doing your rounds that kind of thing, what happened after that? McGarrell: I was sent back to the states. Broome: You were sent back to the states? McGarrell: Assigned to Kessel Air Force base in California. Broome: Okay. So were you glad to leave Iceland. Were you glad to leave Iceland? McGarrell: It’s just..it’s just something you did, ya know. You served your time and did what they told you to. Broome: So basically I do my time and then I’ll move on and it’s all up to them and I have no control over it? McGarrell: Right, right. Broome: So, how did you like the California Air Force Base you were based at? McGarrell: Well, it was a SAC base, a Strategic Air Command base and at that time SAC was a little…rigid..but they had to be about what they were in for, ya know… Actually, where I was staged in in California, I liked it. It was in San Joaquin Valley…a hundred or so miles south of San Francisco and a couple hundred miles north of LA…It wasn’t a bad place but SAC used to 8 �have some strange rules. They used to have these alerts all the time, base sirens were supposed to go off and you were supposed to report. One of the guys had a way of knowing when they were going to have and alert.. and if it was our time..when we were off duty we’d always make sure we were off base when the alert went off..So we didn’t know about it…But the alert went off one time and we didn’t know about it and we had to go report and they said everybody was restricted to base, everyone was going to pull twelve hour shifts, and that…we didn’t know what was happening and they didn’t tell us what was happening. They started loading…This was a B-52 base where they trained, cross-trained B-50 pilots to fly the B-52 and we saw something coming from the weapons dump, the bomb dump. They were carrying what they called “weapons”. A “weapon” was nuclear weapon. They started loading them on the planes. We’d never seen them do that before. So, two days later they told us what was happening. The United States had sent Marines into Lebanon and something was going there in the country of Lebanon and they didn’t know how Russia was going to react, so they was getting ready. When we saw them loading those weapons on those planes it kind of scared us a little bit…As it eventually turned out nothing happened, but for two or three weeks we could not leave the base and those guys that were married, they could leave the base but only go to their quarters where they were living off base. Then they started easing up, we could get off base and then a month or two later they stood us down and we went back to regular shifts…That was kind of scary at the time. Broome: Okay, and what year was this..do you recall? McGarrell: It seems like ’57 or ’58. Broome: And this was..as you say..you were almost shocked.. McGarrell: Yes. Broome: In regards to the weapons you referred to, did everyone just know that, “Hey we have nuclear weapons over here” or was it…a closely guarded secret. McGarrell: We knew they were there. Now, talking about closely guarded. At one time, every time they brought a weapon from the …bomb dump to practice loading it onto a plane it was covered with a tarp and it had an air police security escort leading it…Then they finally got smart and said, “Why are they doing all this? The Russians know what they look like, they probably got our plans.” So, they didn’t cover them up no more. They provided their own security, the people from the bomb dump…The finally got smart…The reason they thought they were keeping it from the Russians..Sure,..the Russians knew what all we had. They probably knew more about than most of us did. Broome: Speaking of that, of course this is during the Cold War. Did you ever notice in particular for California or even Iceland how the Cold War related to the training, any restrictions on you, or any knowledge you gained from that? McGarrell: Nah, no. Broome: It didn’t have any kind of effect on the Air Force as whole that you know of? McGarrell: No, not that I know of. Talking about the Cold War, Russia used to have so called “fishing trawlers.” They used to come up around Iceland, we knew that they were intelligence 9 �ships is what they were..trying to see in..The navy had a squadron of …submarine hunters that they had up there P-2Vs “Neptunes.” They used to go out and bomb this fishing trawlers with their garbage from their lunch. Broome: As in nice little friendly international hospitality for lack of a better word in the Northern Atlantic? McGarrell: Haha, right right. Broome: So basically they’d drop their trash as a friendly, “Hello,hey we know you’re there” kind of thing. So, other than that little humorous anecdote, was their other experience you had other than the nuclear weapons of course? McGarrell: I saw Sputnik, …the first Sputnik, they told us when it was going to come over. They said sometime in the evening. They said if you look there you can see it. You could see it…shining in the air… Broome: How was that moment for you? McGarrell:It was…interesting. Broome: Was it scary? McGarrell:Nah, no. It was just a something they put up there shining at us. Broome: Just the Russians being the Russians kind of thing? At time of Sputnik were you even in the Air Force? Did you hear anything from your superiors regarding Sputnik? McGarrell:They told us about it. Where we could see it that evening. Broome: There was no suspension no…nothing like that? McGarrell:Oh, nah. No. Broome: Alright. So, you’re in California and you witness the issue with the Strategic Air Command and I know you said…let me go back in my notes here…How were they rigid? McGarrell:Uh, they didn’t put up with any foolishness, period. Broome: So, they were very …very serious regarding their training and their basic guidelines and rules they had to follow. McGarrell:And like I said, this was a training base where they trained B-52 pilots. I saw two of them twice while I was stationed in California. One of them landed short of the runway and …one landed on the runway and something happened and it burned right on the runway. Thing about it, some of those plane that were there are still flying today, 57 years later. Broome: The B-52s you’re speaking of? 10 �McGarrell:Yes, because they have…they rebuild them and upgrade them all the time. Broome: Does that ever concern you out of curiosity? McGarrell:Nah, they are very interesting, I’ve been all over them. On my shift, evening shift…nothing going on we’d be… walking flight line guarding these things. We’d climb up in them up through the wheel well, go up and sit in the pilot’s seat for a while and there was a catwalk that went from the pilot’s seat all the way to the tail gunner…We’d go and crawl in there and just sit up there. First thing they ever tell everybody is, “See this D-ring here?” Yes. “Don’t ever touch that.” That’s for the tail gunner to pull if he ever had to bail out. He could pull that and the tail would drop off and he could bail out. They said, “Don’t ever touch that.” Broome: Did anybody ever touch it? McGarrell:No. Broome: It was an understood thing, “Hey, let’s not touch this.” McGarrell:Yeah, this was among the people…I work and out on the flight line. Not for the superiors. Broome:..Of course you weren’t officially allowed to do this, were you? McGarrell:…It’s very mind numbing, dull, boring work. You’re walking around stupid airplanes carrying a rifle for eight hours… Broome: …To keep your own morale up, “Hey there’s an airplane let’s climb in it, right”? McGarrell:Yeah. You could almost train a monkey to do this thing. Broome: That’s an interesting way to put it there, sir…So, you said it was very dull and mind numbing. Was it basically the same experience you had in the clerk’s office in Iceland? McGarrell: Nah…up there in Iceland, while I was doing that job in the clerk’s office I was doing basically the same thing but seeing different people everyday…There was only three or four-three of us in the office and once a while I’d see the squadron commander come in…He didn’t pay us any attention. We were doing our job and that’s all he cared. Broome: …Going back to your story you’re in California on an Air Force Base you’re guarding B-52 at a training base, correct? McGarrell:Right. Broome: …What happened next? McGarrell: Along about…in January or February of 1959..my time was up in April or May I forget at the time, I forget, but in January or February they called three or four or five of us in the squadron commands office and asked how many of us would reenlist. None of us raised our hands. He said y’all will all be separated within two weeks…Said the only catch about it is that if you want reenlist after that you can’t reenlist for 91days. By being out 91 days you’d lose a stripe.... 11 �Broome: Did you ever think of reenlisting or was it an instant, “I don’t want to do that kind of thing”? McGarrell: I didn’t think…I didn’t want to reenlist…You couldn’t get out of the career field. I couldn’t see 20 years guarding air planes. Broome: So you didn’t see that there was any…? McGarrell: There wasn’t a future in it Broome:..wasn’t a future in it. McGarrell: Right. Broome: Do you regret that? Do you regret that at all? McGarrell: I have at times. Maybe if I’d been in a different career field, I’d have stayed in, but not in that field….Although one time during Vietnam I was living in Fayetteville. Broome: This was Fayetteville..? McGarrell: North Carolina, where Fort Bragg is. All my neighbors were army…airborne. They were also training new recruits at Fort Bragg for Vietnam. I thought about, “Could I reenlist?” I thought about it and thought no I couldn’t I had married in the time and had one child. I could not make enough to support them. If I had been single I may have gone back in then… Broome: It was one of those things financially..You didn’t think you could support a larger family which you had which in California was just you….You were..I know your time ran up in April or May of ’59, you were discharged then? McGarrell: Yeah, right…Then after that that I was in what they call inactive reserve up til my eight year obligation was up, which would have been…about 1962. You didn’t really have to do anything. You were supposedly viable to be called back up if there was an outbreak in hostilities…There was nothing. Broome: …Let’s say you joined the Air Force a couple years later that would have put that 1962 to 1965, 1966. McGarrell: I’d be in the middle of Vietnam probably…Now, joining the Air Force when I did..or going it closer. Back then…they had a GI Bill then that ran out I believe January 1954. If you were in before then you got what they call education benefits and all that…and I never thought about that. I went in 2 or 3 months too late to get that. It would have made a big difference in my life…It would have made a difference in my life if I had went in early enough to get those benefits. I could have gone to college earlier instead of going to college when I was 40-something. Broome: So, ’59 you are out of the Air Force,…what’d you do career wise? McGarrell: I became a police officer in Roanoke, Virginia. Broome: Do you feel like your military experience in the Air Force helped you get this job? 12 �McGarrell:Oh yeah. Broome: Just outta curiosity, how was the civilian police force of Roanoke, Virginia different than the…? McGarrell: Oh..night and day. In the civilian police force you’re dealing with, all kinds of …I don’t wanna call people “garbage”…You’re dealing with a lower, generally a lower classes of civilians. In the Air Force, you didn’t have those types of problems. You were doing something entirely different, like I was guarding airplanes or working on gates going into and off the base. Broome: So you ended up being a police officer in Roanoke for two and a half years? How’d you like that? McGarrell: I didn’t. Towards the end I could see that there was no future in it. If you wanted to get ahead you had to play the politics..and two and half years I was the low man on senority in my shift. There was very little turn over. So I got looking and I was able to get in a management training program at a retail store and they trained me to be store manager. Broome: A retail program? McGarrell: Old W.T.Grant Company, they didn’t at that time, they didn’t require the manager to be a college graduate. They had certain tests they put you through …and if you passed these tests and fit their profile, they’d put you in the training program…They’d teach you everything you needed to know to run..a store. Broome: Alright, well, I know you talked about this training program. Do you feel like there was more..I know you spoke of your future several times, do you feel that in your civilian life there was ..easier to advance in your career? McGarrell: Oh yeah, oh yeah. Everywhere I’ve been. I’ve had several different careers in my time but you can do it. At least when I was in a military you were on a certain path and that was it. Broome: You said once you were in a certain path that was it. Do you think there was any flexibility? ..For your example you came out of your training and you were going to Air Base Security and you were stuck on that more or less, you felt stuck there. McGarrell: Oh yeah. Broome: Well, let me ask your overall military experience as a whole? Does that still effect you today? McGarrell: Oh yes, you gain discipline…I think part of what’s wrong with our country today, and there are some things that are wrong with the country, is that there is no …military training or not necessarily military training but ..obligation to do something for the country for a couple years. Back then, there basically was and I think it made a difference. Broome: Would you be in favor of having some kind of, not necessarily military obligation but some kind of service obligation? 13 �McGarrell: Yes, yes. Broome: You said back when you were serving you had an eight year obligation. McGarrell: Yes, eight year obligation you had. Now there were certain ways of getting out..physically…or some guys would get married and have a baby real quick that’d get them out of it. Or if you were a ministerial student or a medical student you could get deferred. Broome: Alright, but you said you gained a lot of discipline. Is there anything you notice about yourself that still shows the fact that you have a military background Like is there any particular trait? McGarrell: People, several people, have talked about the way I walk and stand. Broome: The way you walk and stand? McGarrell: They say, “Were you in the military?” Broome: They can almost pick you out of a crowd you’d say? McGarrell: Yes, I never notice it, but… Broome: It’s just one of those things that people notice about you. And I’m sure that must look great on a resume, pretty great, having military experience on your resume. McGarrell: Yeah, it did. In some cases it does. Broome: Do you think that helped you with you retail position you spoke of? McGarrell: Oh yeah, because back then, they didn’t pay much to a trainee, but if you were married you got $5 above the starting pay and if were in college and if you had been in service you got $5 more. Broome: And you were married at the time? McGarrell: Yeah, so I got two out of three. Broome: Alright, and you ended up in retail and have been in a couple of different..positions, jobs, fields, since then. Let me ask you this question and you can answer it however you want. Do you ever regret your military service? McGarrell: No, not at all. Broome: You don’t regret it and you feel like you learned a lot from it? McGarrell: Yeah, yeah I learned some things and got to see some things..How else would I ever see the country of Iceland?..How else would I have seen California? I was in California twice, when I went to school out there and when I came back from overseas I was stationed out there…I met some nice people out there. 14 �Broome: Well, sir, we’re coming to the end of our interview here is there any final statement you’d like to make regarding military or anything like that or how you feel our military is…the Air Force in particular ..or just military in general in the current state. McGarrell: As far as I know, it’s …they’re all in good shape…I talked to a young man yesterday. He had a Marine Corps lanyard and I asked him, “Are you a Marine?” He said, “No, I leave in December for basic training. I said, “Good luck” and I said, “I admire any young man who can make it through the Marine corps boot camp.” The Marine Corps is the hardest boot camp there is of course there are tears. The Army is next followed by the Navy then the Air Force. Anybody who makes it through boot camp in the military today, even the Air Force, basic training, I respect them. Broome: Alright, sir well we are going to wrap up our interview. I’d like to thank Mr. Patrick McGarrell again for the record and what was your rank again, sir?..What was your rank again sir, your highest rank achieved? McGarrell: Airman 2nd. Broome: 2nd Airman Patrick McGarrell, thank you for your time. 15 � https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/6d4045f1d4e61c9997c59801d6cf9b29.mp3 b31a5f5c2efea9a79f825a5ad271f317 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Appalachian State University American Military History Course Veterans Oral History Project Description An account of the resource Each semester, the students of the American Military History Course at Appalachian State University conduct interviews with military veterans and record their military experiences in order to create an archive of oral history interviews that are publicly accessible to researchers. The oral histories are permanently available in the Appalachian State University Special Collections. The project is supervised by Dr. Judkin Browning, Associate Professor of History at Appalachian State University and all interviews are transcribed by the student interviewers. Copyright Notice: Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project’s audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used (e.g. Veterans Oral History Project, University Archives and Records, Special Collections, Appalachian State University, Boone, NC). Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. File size 57.3 KB 55.1 MB Format, digital MP3 Military Branch military branch (U.S. Army, etc) Naval Reserve/ Air Force Officer Rank Officer rank (major, private, etc) Airman, 2nd class Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Broome; David McGarrell; Patrick Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview. Broome, David Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed. McGarrell, Patrick Interview Date 10/12/2012 Number of pages 15 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 0:40:10 Date digitized 2/5/2015 Checksum alphanumeric code ad8317757023073c53d9b505a3b19758 b31a5f5c2efea9a79f825a5ad271f317 Scanned by Leah McManus Equipment Adobe Acrobat XI Pro Resolution 300 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project's audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal; non-commercial; and educational use; provided that proper citation is used. Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived UA.5018. American Military History Course Records Recording rate A/V rate (48,000kzh x 16 bit) 48000kzh x 16 bit Format, original Electronic File Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 5018_McGarrell_Patrick_20121012_transcript_M 5018_McGarrell_Patrick_20121012_audio_A Title A name given to the resource Interview with Patrick McGarrell, Airman 2nd Class [October 12, 2012] Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Language A language of the resource English English Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Broome, David McGarrell, Patrick Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a title="UA.5018. American Military History Course Records" href="https://appstate-speccoll.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/167" target="_blank">UA.5018. American Military History Course Records</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project's audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used. Description An account of the resource Patrick McGarrel, born in 1936, went to basic training twice: first for the Naval Reserve and second for the Air Force. After that he went to a language school which he said had "a 97, 98 percent washout rate" and flunked out. He ended up serving at an Air Base in Iceland for a year. Subject The topic of the resource McGarrel, Patrick Veterans United States Interviews Air Base Defense Air Force Iceland Korean War language school Naval Reserve https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/2b0ccdc7a7cc94a2e1007425296f5b21.pdf 485a0001a414e378d44a5807264da5bc PDF Text Text 1 Mrs. B: Tell them about going to Berea. Then tell about coming to Boone, and then tell about teaching your first school. Mr. B: Well, I better just go on to Boone. and won't get finished. I'll get so much history in there Well, start out there then. Mrs. B: Tell them where you were born. Mr. B: Alright, ready? Interviewer: I'm ready. Mrs. B: Just talk natural. Mr. B: I was born at Bakersville, Mitchell County, North Carolina, in 1892. What year, if you want to. In 1908, I went to Berea College and was there until 1917. particular time there was not a high scnool in this county. At that I even had my eighth grade, my high school work, and my college work at Berea College. In 1917, I went to the Naval/Aviation Air Force and served seventeen months until the armistice was signed. Then I came home to North Carolina at Spear in Avery County and in 1919, I went to Appalachian Training School. Interviewer: Is that the same place where Appalachian State University is now? Mr. B: At that particular time, there were only four buildings on the campus. Interviewer: How many students were there at that time? Do you have any recollection of how many? Mr. B: At the summer school, there was about 150 students. Newland Hall with Warsaw Braswell. I roomed in Old Dr. Dougherty and his brother had started this school in 1900 and it was known as Appalachian Training School. Interviewer: Was this education oriented, like for teachers, that sort of thing? Mrs. B: It was just a normal, teacher's normal. �2 Interviewer: What is, what do you mean by a teacher's normal? Mr. B: It was changed, you want to get this down? Interviewer: Sure. Mr. B: It was changed the next year to Appalachian Normal School for teachers. Mrs. B: It was known as Appalachian State Teacher's College and you couldn't take all these degrees, just college only. Mr.B: I had Dr. Dougherty as one of my teachers. tory. Dr. Rankin taught English. Dr. I.G. Greer taught his- Shut if off there just a minute, what was that. Mrs. B: I'll get out of it. Mr . B: I put in there about teaching six months school, didn't I? Mrs. B: No, you didn't. Interviewer: I don't think you did. Mr.B: After, you can turn it on now. After getting my teacher's and principal's certificate by going to school at Appalachian, I taught a six months school at Hughes, North Carolina. Interviewer: A six months, that means that . . . Mr. B: At that time we only had six months schools and at the end of the school year about Christmas time, I had a letter from Dr. Dougherty wanting me to come to Boone. I got on Tweetsie and went over and spent the night with Dr. Dougherty, and he offered me a position as a teacher and monitor of Newland Hall, but at that time I had already signed up to go to Sylva, North Carolina, and teach another six months school because down in the Piedmont section, they only had six month school and they didn't start it until after Christmas, hoeing and cutting tobacco. Interviewer: Were these for all grades of students and . . . �3 Mrs. B: For how many grades of students? Interviewer: Was this like on a high school level? Mr.B: For all grades. Interviewer: All grades. Mr.B: Yeah. Mrs. B: It was a grammar school, wasn't it? Mr. B: Yeah, a granunar school. Inerviewer: And were there. Mr. B: There wasn't a high school in, in. Mrs. B: (garbled) Interviewer: Yeah, was this, were these grades taught all together or did they have like different classrooms and other teachers or were you the only one teaching or . . . ? Mr. B: No. I just had one helper at the first school.I taught with Molly Ramsey. She's still living up here at Banner Elk here. Interviewer: Boy, that's really something! Mr. B: I had the, I had the first four grades. She had the first, second, and third grade and I had fifth, fourth, fifth, sixth, and seventh. seventh then was the eighth. The You graduated from high school in the eleventh grade here then after that, later on, they added the twelfth. Interviewer: I see. So, so you all, like, did you . . . you grew up in this area all your life, right? Mr. & Mrs. B: Yeah. InE!rViewer: Right, right around Minneapolis. Mr. B: Well. . Interviewer: Did you stay . . . how long did you, did y 'all stay in Bakersville and you could even tell us when you met and all that sort of thing, if you would like to. �4 Mr. B: Like what. . • Inerviewer: You could even tell us like how y'all got together and how you, where you spent your childhood years. Mrs. B: Ir's a funny thing about how we got a hold of this property. Interviewer: Really? Mrs. B: Yeah. Mr. B: Yeah. Mrs. B: Well, let's finish up about that edu . . . Interviewer: Educational thing. Mrs. B: Yeah. Interviewer: O.K. Mrs. B: And tell what year you graduated at Appalachian. This going to be helter skelter business because you don't know where you're at unless you know what you're gonna say. Mr. B: Well, I might put this in, when you start it out, when l - finished at Berea College, there were no such a thing as accredited schools at that day and time. Later on, they required a principal to have a degree from an accredited school. So in 1935 and '·36, I went back to Appalachian and got my Bachelor of Science degree. Mrs. B: That was in '38, Wallace. Mr.B: In 1936. In~rviewer: And what did you do after that, when you got your degree? Mr.B: At that time, I made a score of 99 and 6/10% in my school studies and Dr. Dougherty called me into the office again and offered me a job teaching history. Interviewer: So did you do that? Mr. B: But I told him I'd already signed up to be principal at Riverside School and consolidate it. �5 Interviewer: Riverside school? Where is that located? Mrs. B: Plumtree. Interviewer: Plumtree? Mr. B: And I told him, you're getting this? Interviewer: Yeah. Mr . B: And I told him, I'd rather just be a country school principal rather Is that one of the first schools around here? than to teach in college which I did until I retired in 1954 at Elk Park, North Carolina, at the age of 54. Mrs. B: 64! Mr. B: 64: Mrs. B: You were sixty-two. Mr. B: I retired in '54. Mrs. B: You retired in '54, but you was sixty-two years old. Mr. B: And I retired at the age of sixty-two. Interviewer: I see. Mrs. B: Tell her how the roads were in those days, how you had to lay down and You retired at sixty-two, not sixty-five . That's really something. put chains on going to Riverside school, how we did. Interviewer: Was it really rough here? It usually is pretty rough up here in the winter time. Mrs. B: Yes. Interviewer: How, how long a time did people get let out of school? Mr. B: I'm Interviewer: Sure. Mrs. B: Well, wait a minute and get this, get this. gonna tell you about me getting married and you can record that. Wallace, she asked you about uh . . . well now, back then you had to miss more days than you do now. Mr. B: I didn't miss at Riverside. Mrs. B: Oh, you never did miss at Riverside. �6 Mr. B: Only one day I missed and that was when it was sleeted. Mrs. B: Now, last year they missed a lot . . . Mr.B: And I was there ten years . just two buses. Mrs. B: I brought in six different schools there with The first year, one bus had to make three runs. Tell about the roads, and a little bit about the roads and tell how they developed them up until today. Interviewer: O. K. Mr. B: Well. Interviewer: Does 19E, was 19E through here? Mr. B: 19E, when we got married, was just a mud road through here but it's . . . Mrs. B: Gravel road! Mr. B: It was just . . . they graveled it. Mrs. B: The year we married . Mr. B: The year, the year we got married. Interviewer: I see . Mrs. B: 1924 . Interviewer: 1924. When was that, if I might ask? And then you were, Mrs. Buchanan you were talking about something you wanted to say about how you got ahold of this land, or something like that. Mrs. B: Let me show you this little piece of the road. Interviewer: Could you tell me something about the Tweetsie railroad and when it washed away and all that sort of thing? Mrs. B: Yes, oh yes. Tell her that when we first moved here in '24, Tweetsie railroad ran through this section from Johnson City to Boone and they had excursions on it . You know they used to have excursions on it. Interviewer: Was there, was there a train depot in the innnediate area? Mr.B: Right back up here, there was just a shed back out here on the side of the hill. �7 Interviewer: Right here in Minneapolis? Mr.B: That they stopped. Mrs. B: Well, the depot in Minneapolis. Mr.B: And the, uh, and the train came down here, plum down in here and went up here and then went down in to Minneapolis. Mrs. B: That's what you call a . Mr.B: This building right over here is. Mrs. B: That's the switchback. Mr. B: Switchback. Mrs. B: They call it the switchback. Interviewer: I see. Mr.B: They stopped it in 1932. Interviewer: How large was this train?. How many passengers did you think it would hold? Mr. B: Well, they generally hold about a baggage car and six passenger coaches. Interviewer: I see. Mrs. B: On occasions when they was coming through here on excursions they'd have about, oh about eight to ten coaches on it. Mr.B: Well, they had observation coaches. Mrs. B: Yeah. Mr.B: They'd stop right up here on the hill and look down the river toward And they'd stop right up here on this hil±. Spruce Pine. Mrs. B: Every time, Mr. Black was the president at the time, and every time he came through here he had the train stop. Mr. B: Had them stop up there. Mrs. B: Because it's such a beautiful view down the valley. Ina-viewer: I bet that was beautiful! Mrs. B: I wish it ran today! I wish it ran today! �8 Mr. B: I believe that old, I believe that old depot is in Boone yet. They're using it for something. They're using it for something or another. Mrs. B: Now, I went to Boone after we were married. go back and forth. I went to Boone and I'd I'd stay over there and room over there. Then, I'd come back on Tweetsie and get off up here on the hill, up back over here it was the time so, I'd travel back and forth on Tweetsie and I'd go to sunnner school. I'd take six weeks at a time and I'd come home every weekend, but I'd have to ride Tweetsie. Interviewer: How much did it cost to ride on the train back and forth or one way or whatever? Mrs. B: Very little. Mr. B: It wasn't but less than a dollar to go to Boone. Mrs. B: I think it was less than a dollar, maybe around a dollar each way. Interviewer: How, did it stop in Boone or like what was, how far down that way did it go to Marion? Mr. & Mrs. B: No, it went into Minneapolis. Interviewer: Just into Minneapolis, I see. Mrs. B: Do you know where Francis' Beauty Shop is, that building that was just burned down here? InB:'viewer: Yeah. Mrs. B: Well right over in the bottom, across from that was the depot. My uncle ran the depot, the man that owned this house. Interviewer: I see. Mrs. B: So he was the depot agent. Inerviewer: And then it just went around to Boone and then . . . �9 Mrs. B: . . . stopped here. Mrs. B: That's all the farther it went. Mrs. B: It went up to Newland and it would go into Pineola and stopped at Minneapolis, stopped all along the way, stopped at Stony Elk Park, stopped at Cranberry, stopped at Minneapolis, stopped at Newland and then it went down into Pineola and then came back and went around to Linville and then into Boone. That's the way it had to run. Mr. B: It's four miles into Pineola. Mrs. B: Yeah. Mr. B: The railroad was first built to haul timber out of this country and it was built to Cranberry to haul iron ore down to Johnson City. Mrs B: The iron ore mine is at Cranberry. Mr.B: They still run the iron ore mine. In~viewer: They still run the iron ore mine? Mr. B: It's still running over here at Cranberry. Mrs. B: It was the main way of transportation in that day. Everybody that wanted to travel, the roads were very poor and crooked and there were not very many hard serviced roads. could go to Johnson City and shop. We would ride the train and we Oh, I guess we'd leave her along about 9:00 and go to Johnson City, then come back and get off the train. But you know, back in those days, it was an attraction for people because everybody would go to a train stop. they gather at the post offices today. Why people were there like They'd gather when the train stopped. Mr. B: They'd gather to see who got off and who got on. Interviewer: That's really something. Mrs. B: They'd stop anywhere and pick up. If I was along the road down here, and flagged them dewn, they'd stop and pick me up. �10 Mr. B: And another thing they done away with is the Star Route post offices. Now they've got them on rural routes. I'd say they've cut out all over the United States, two-thirds of the rural post offices. Interviewer: Really. Mr. B: We get ours still at Minneapolis. Interviewer: Minneapolis? Mrs. B: But there is a route that runs through here. Mr. B: But now they cut out Frank down here. Where do you pick up your mail now? Roaring Creek. Do they still . . They cut out Valley up on They cut out Powder Hill post office and they still have a post office in Plumtree. They cut out the one at Ingalls. They cut out the one at Three Miles. Interviewer: Why, what is it? Did they just want one place where everybody comes to get their mail? Mr. B: Rural routes go out from Elk Park and three or four of them go out to Newland. Mrs. B: The one that goes out from Elk Park, that's about an eighty mile route. This man goes way back into Beech Mountain and then comes back to Elk Park. Interviewer: Does he do all this in one day? Mrs. B: In one day. Mr. B: Oh yeah. Interviewer: Boy! Mrs. B: It's a hard job. Mr. B: And people would gather at the post off ice like they would at the depot to get their mail when the mail comes in. Interviewer: Really. Well, you know those fellows over at the Inn? haven't heard from that woman. You know, I I wrote her a letter and I was wondering like when the Inn was built, the Appalachian Inn down here. �11 Mrs. B: Well, I guess that would be. very easy because that's a very famous eating place today down here and get ahold of Bernice or . . . Interviewer: I tried to write her but I'm not really sure, maybe I can get her by phone. Mr. B: The Appalachian Inn, I boarded that a year before I was married . I was teaching there, six months school. The girls that run that came to school with me. Mrs. B: We started our teaching career in Minneapolis, together. I taught two years. Mr. B: I taught the year, three teachers school year then, and I taught the year before and then I got married and I had a vacancy and I put my wife in it, of course. She taught then until she went to Elk Park. You taught three years here before you went to Elk Park, didn't you? Interviewer: Was this sort of like an apartment sort of thing. ¥ou know, like when you stayed at the Inn? Mrs. B: It was just like it is now except it's just been remodeled. Interviewer: I see, so they have like a cottage or that sort of thing? Mr. B: The one that they feed the big dinners in is the same old building. I guess it's . . . Mrs. B: It would be interesting to talk to Bernice or Hope, one, and let them tell you the early history of that because it's very interesting . Mr . B: History of the Appalachian Inn . Mrs. B: Even before we came to Minneapolis. Interviewer: Well maybe before we leave today we can swing by and just go visit them, Now we've been here 55 years. maybe go talk to them about it. Mrs B: I bet you could. They'd be glad to see you. Interviewer: That'd be great! That's real interesting. stayed there. I didn't know that you How about some of the churches in this area? know like if there was only one church at one time? Do you Which ones were �12 the original churches? Mr. B: Well the original churches in this were. Mrs. B: Not Minneapolis she's talking about. Mr. B: The Baptist. Mrs. B: And the Methodist. Mr. B: And the Methodist. Mrs. B: And later the Chrustian church. lt was the Baptist church. This new Christian church was built in Minneapolis. Mr. B: That's where we belong. We belong to the Christian church. Mrs. B: 1932. Interviewer: I see. Mrs. B: It was built in 1932. Mr.B: Well now, well, recollect there were two buildings before we built that It was a beautiful church too. big rock building down there. Interviewer: I see. The Minneapolis school now, do they teach first through eighth grade? Mr. B: Yeah, first through eighth grade now. Mrs. B: Not to begin with. When we came to Minneapolis, there were three teachers with a three room building, and he was ~he principal. Mr. B: Three rooms, three school rooms. Mrs. B: And when we were married we taught school down here, I guess two or three years, and then we transferred to Elk Park. a three-room school. Mr.B: It had three teachers. But anyway, it was A Mrs. Boners had a Well up on Little Horse Creek there, remember Shelby? that's the doctor over in Pineola now, there. Dr. Shelby Vance, he had a little school house up He taught first grade through anybody that through the eighth to anybody that would come. �13 Mrs. B: Really through the sixth grade back then. Course, we just had the first sixth grades when we first came here. Interviewer: Did you have trouble getting people to come to school? Mr. & Mrs. B: No. Mr. B: The first school I ever went to was over just above Bakersville at Not too much. White Oak and it was a log school house and it had split logs with holes bored through them and legs put in them and I remember to get up in one, that was in 19 and, oh, 1898, I had to put my knee up and pull myself up and then sit there with my legs hanging down like that. Interviewer: How about now? Like how many students would you say attend the school down in Minneapolis? M s. B: r They had as much as 300. I didn't know if they had three hundred this last year or not, but it's developing. Until now, when we taught down here it was about an eight·· teacher school. M r.B: Well now. Mrs. B: I mean in late years, not at the Mr. B: Yeah. fir~t. Well when I went to Riverside and consolidated these six different schools down here the hundred and thirty~six highest~~~~~~~~~four students one tim a Mrs. B: And you had ten teachers too. Mr.B: I had thirteen. Mrs. B: Did you? Mr. B: I had thirteen. M s. B: r So you see the school's really made a rapid growth of progress in these years. Mr. B: And a heap of the, a heap of the students or the teachers had been to Berea College. �14 Interviewer: I see. Mr.B: Berea, Kentucky. Mrs. B: But you know most of the teachers we had at Riverside come from Boone, graduated at Boone. Mr.B: Yeah, they graduated at Boone. Appalachian. Appalachian has, and you know that. Xt's been a wonder, I'm going to tell you this. It got to the point where so many Florida teachers would come up there and register up for one subject and room in the dormitory and spend the sunnner up there at Boone in the girl's dormitory, especially girls. Mrs. B: Because it was a vacation for them. Mr.B: And they would come up there and spend the sunnner. Mrs. B: They would rent but one or two courses and then they got the requirement to take three courses. Mr. B: And besides that they got their board cheap. .Mrs. B: Back then it was, well it was a nice vacation for them • Mr. B: Then they got, they, they, well, it was along in the forties they got to changing them. They had to carry a full load. Mrs. B: Three subjects. Interviewer: I see. Mr. B: They had to carry at least three subjects. Mrs. B: I had a lot of classmates from Florida when I was up there. Mr . B: Yeah, well, you see why they would. Inerviewer: I can see definitely why they would. Mr. B: A lot of teachers came up there. They was making a regular summer resort out of the summer school. Interviewer: Boy, that's really something! Mrs. B: Now, how many do you have over there now? �15 I~terviewer: How many at Appalachian? Mrs. B: At least a thousand during regular time? Interviewer: I think it's probably over ten thousand, I guess twenty. Mr. B: I think it's something over ten thousand. Interviewer: I'm not really sure. Mr.B: I see where they're doing a lot more building over there now. Interviewer : Yeah • they're building two new dormitories over there and they're , increasing the library; they're adding on to that. Mrs. B: Well, last year, when we went to the reunion over there, I don't know how many -- how many were there? Mr.B: That whole building full! Well, one thing, in place of doing my practice teaching, I'd already had practice teaching at, have had at Berea College, but Howell was principal of the elementary school which was connected with the college as well as the high school over there. And the last three months, in the spring term, Mr. Howell wanted to go and get, go to George Peabody in Nashville, Tennessee, which is a university, a big university in Nashville, and he put me in as the head teacher and principal of the elementary school for the last spring term. And I had about sixteen practice teachers under me. Mrs. B: Tell her about the night you had to spend the night there on account of the snow to take care of the children . Mr .B: Well, it was along in the last of February . It begin to snowing all that morning and just kept pouring and pouring the snow and pouring the snow and the snow got eight and ten inches deep. And the elementary building there, I, we had to send to get blankets and quilts from different places and several of the children slept on the floor . Because it was too rough to go outside and go home? �16 1-tr. B: You couldn't , the buses couldn 't run. Mrs . B: Snow was too deep. Interviewer: Boy! Mrs. B: Snow was too deep. Ini:!rviewer: And a lot of those kids probably come from way up in the country. Mr.B : Some of them would come from, brought them in from eight or ten miles, maybe twelve, over towards Deep Gap, you know where Deep Gap is? Interviewer: Oh, yeah . Mrs. B: That was 1936. Mr. B: Yeah, nineteen, the spring of 1936. InB:'viewer: That is long ways away . Mr . B: And not only that, I came over from Justice, Justice Hall there, and I couldn't come the road and I just come down the steep bank . Mrs. B: It's not Justice Hall now . ? 1r. B: And we came around by where the country home is for the old folks. It 's that new dormitory . This never, 105 hadn't been built, the railroad went 105, that's the way you came over here now, we came around by Valdese and up by Banner Elk. Mrs . . B: Tell them about that because that had dead bodies. Mr. B: And we came around right below the old folks ' home there and the hearse was stole there and had been stole there ever since 10:00 in the night . And it ·had a dead body in it ! Interviewer: Oh Lord! Mr. B: And they had convicts shoveling snow and we came to Valley Mountain. I left early that morning and I never got in home here until 2 :00 the next morning, but when I got to the top of the Howard's Mountain above Banner Elk there, why Avery County had it all cleared off but there was �17 certain places, the snow was twenty feet deep. Interviewer: Boy! Mr.B: You couldn't tell where the road was! Mrs. B: Drifts! Mr.B: It snowed for three days! Interviewer: What happens when people like get really snowed in and they live pretty far out in the county? Does anybody go check on them or anything, make sure they have stuff they need? Mr. B: Just a few years ago, they had over here in Ashe county, they had so much snow they had to drop food for the cattle, hay for the cattle and they dropped food to different homes. Mr s . B: But now, I'll tell you, · most of the people, they'll already have a supply of food . You know, they all can and they all freeze food and they're well protected in that way because . Mr.B: Mountain people always canned a lot and they dried a lot of food, too. Mrs. B: We do that still, we do that still, here. Really, nobody suffered. It was about '60 I believe when they had that awful snowstorm through, especially around Ashe County, around Boone. Boone gets a whole lot more snow than we do here but they have ways. Mr.B: If it snows anywhere, it snows in Boone. Interviewer: Yeah. M~ B: Mrs. B: That's what they always said. We have an awful efficient rescue squad now. When they get hurt up on Beech Mountain or get snowed in, this rescue squad cars, they just go get them and bring them to the hospital or whatever. Mr. B: I believe it 's three or four years ago, 's airplane fell into some trees up there. They rescued the two fellows in the airplane. �18 Interviewer: Well that's good; I'm glad they're alright. Mr. B: On Beech Mountain. Interviewer: What did you think about them putting the new highway through here? Are you glad to see that happen or did you like it the way it was before? I have a lot of mixed feelings about the highway they put in Boone, but I was just wondering like how the people responded to that. Through here? Now at first they opposed it very much, a lot of them. A lot of em say today right through here now, and we're one of. we're some of them, that if it were to do over we wouldn't be for this highway because it 's caused us alot of anxiety, a lot of hard work, that would of . . . they could of straightened it out and everybody says it up this valley ?nd out. Mr. B: They didn't have to take my rock pillars down there. Interviewer: No they didn't. They took your rock pillars down when they built the highway? . Mrs. B: Mr. B: Yes . They took, when they built the new highway, they took the rock pillars and my wrought iron gates . The rock pillars were 9 feet high with the gates built in them. Interviewer: And did they do that to a lot of people's yards or whatever? Mrs. B: Yes they did. If the highway did the . . . mislocate lots of people, their way of life. I nterviewer: Well did you have any choice as to whether or did you actually sell part of that footage that they took away there? Mrs. B: Yeah. They allow you so much. to do over, I wouldn't sign . They didn't give us enough. If it were �19 Mr . B: Where the road is down here, the owner had about half an acre of bottom land right there . And I sold the bottom land I had, all the rest is mountain land . Mrs . B: Well I ' d like to say this too . For the amount they paid us for the damage, I ' d rather it be back like it was because we would still have our rock pillars and wouldn ' t have to have gone through all this anxiety . They didn ' t pay enough for it . I wouldn't have the rock pillars torn out for the amount they paid for the road . 'Cause I ' m glad it ' s over now , and I ' m glad that we ' ve got the good road, but a lot of people were displeased with it. But I think now after it ' s kinda getting finished up , they feel a little differently about it . They do a lot of destruction . Mr . B: You see , they took all this hill off behind me right here to make that 50 foot field that comes do~m there . Still it ' s a steep road . Interviewer: Well, what do you think the reason for doing that? Mr . B: Well they wanted to make the road straighter . Mrs. B: And a better grade . Mr . B: And a better grade and widen it out. Mrs. B: There would have been . . . if they ' d gone up the valley and missed us and missed a lot of things and said Mr . B: Howard~~~~~~~~~~~over ~~~~~~~~~~ They were coming up here into my hard and we got a new survey on it and they went down 3 0 feet . Mrs . B: They would ' ve ruined us . Mr . B: Our house would be sitting up here on a bank . Interviewer : Well did they come to you and talk to you about all this and get you . here �20 Mrs . B: No, they surveyed it first . Mr. B: No, they surveyed it first and then we brought the - - --- and got in here and surveyed it . . Mrs . B: Yeah, I came home..: fi:onC Elor.ida :: and . Mr . B: Pegs were out here in the yard. Mrs . B: to throw the things away, and Mama come home ---------~ she ' ll have a heart attack, come up through her yard, so they threw the pegs away in the morning and we came home. And the man hauling us knew him, got this man to bring three of the surveyors there, because we just told them we could not accept a survey coming through our yard. So this man came down and he said, " I ' m glad you weren ' t here when I put pegs in your yard . " put pegs in my yard?" And I said, "You I said, "ThE;r'r.e not here now!" And I didn ' t throw them away either . we could put them back . " (Laughter) And he said , "Well you know I said, "You aren ' t putting them back, you're not putting them back 'cause you ' re not coming through our yard . " They was going to take a ll my shrubberies through here . So we got a new survey and they went down the hill . They don ' t consider your feelings, they don ' t consider anything when they ' re surveying , especially surveyors. Interviewer: Well, they're just doing their job.. Mrs . B: Trying to do their job . Interviewer : And they, they ' re probably just really immune to the nature of what That ' s what they say . it is they ' re doing probably. Mrs . B: They don ' t hav~much feeling . But anyway the road is here and I ' m glad it ' s here . Interviewer : Well did anybody around here try to stop it coming through at all or get any kind of . . . �21 Mrs . B: Oh yes ! Oh yes ! Some Qoman in Cranberry said she ' d go to jail before they took any of her yard . Mr . B: They didn ' t widen it out in Cranberry except . . . they didn ' t take any out . . . well they did, two houses were moved back . torn down that is right on the road. One was That one that Earl Greene lived in. Mrs . B: Well, I think most of them that are . . . well 'course there ' s the case of have to. You just had to accept it . law , you wouldn't win. If you went into They ' d win, the state would win . We couldn ' t Francis said they didn't pay us a third of what we should have . ' Cause I'd rather have it back, than what little money they paid us and we had to, of course, take out the money they paid us and put the rock pillars back and that cost us 1000 dollars . Mr . B: I have $1,000 to have the iron gates put back and the pillars built- in other words-just the work. Mrs . B: Well really - - - - , I think sometimes these things will come through . We ' ve called it progress, sometimes I think it ' s destruction and I'll make that statement anywhere . Mr . B: Well, they couldn ' t . ·. . now you take . . . they won't build a county road here, and we need a lot of county roads, like the one going up the river from here up to Newland. there now. It's only 5 miles up through But they want a 60 foot right of way ! now it don't matter where it is, they want 60 feet . need 60 feet . road 14 feet Mrs. B: For any state road Well they don ' t All they need is 30 feet. Because they only build a -----------------~ Well in connection with this road business, I ' d like to say that they claim they want to keep the ecology like it is and the beauty and to me they destroy so many beautiful trees that've been growing �22 50 to 100 years. You can ' t replace a tree in a short length of time . And that ' s the objection I have to new roads. They destroy so much beautiful surroundings. Mr . B: We go down through Georgia, we keep trying to find us a shade tree we can pull out under . And they're just little. Mrs . B : Well now we ' re not talking about Georgia . Mr . B: Well I know, but I say that ' s it, they ' ve cut all the trees away from the road. Interviewer: From around here . Mr . B: And that's what they want to do when they build a little county road now . Interviewer : Well I was really amazed when I came here a few weeks ago for the first time and saw what they had done to the road. Mrs.B: I wish you could ' ve seen this before, when we first came here it was terrible all the beautiful trees were down and Mr. B: For two years the dust came right upon my porch and we had to sweep it up in a dust pan and take . . Interviewer: While they were working on the road? Mr . B: While they were working on the road, yeah . Mrs. B: We didn't get to sit on the porch anytime. Mr . B: I had to redo my porch everywhere . Mrs. B: Had to take a hoe and scrape it . it . Just sprayed it before we painted If it were not for destroying so many beautiful trees and things .a nd stuff like that, a new road wouldn ' t be too bad . Interviewer : Well since this new road has been built and everything has this increased like the traffic? Mrs . B: Yes . They fly up and down this straight part through there . mortally fly . They just �23 Mr. B: We have to be careful going out, because they really come off that hill a flyin now. Mrs . B: I think it ' s created a lot of danger traps; the straight roads. Mr. B: You know, it's on the straight roads that people get killed more . Mrs. B: Some woman said to me not long ago she said I went over here you just come right down the mountain . Shooo! Into Minneapolis. Said a few years ago said it was so pretty and widening and said, and the beautiful trees, said it just ruined the looks of Minneapolis she said . Interviewer : (Laughter) Going into Minneapolis. I didn ' t even know I was in Minneapolis when I came here the other day; all of a sudden I was just there ' cause it just really, and trees would hang over the road. Mrs . B: Oh! So and in the fall especially, it was so pretty down through here, so many pretty maples. I did save my red bud tree. I wrote a poem to put on it and the highway men left it. Mr . B: It was 6 inches on their right of way, but they left it. Interviewer: You said something about a poem? Mrs. B: Yeah, I did . Interviewer: What did you write a poem about? Mrs . B: About the tree! Let me tell you about it. a couple had given us down at Charlotte . It was a beautiful blooming red bud. I had this red bud that It was about 12 feet tall . So I said to Wallace, I said, you know, I hate to see that highway take my red bud tree. I'm going to write a little poem and tie a red ribbon around it, around that tree and see if they'll save that tree. what I wrote . I said: So this is �24 I'm just a blooming red bud tree. Will you please leave me so the people who travel this highway, . . . I'm not getting that right. Wait just a minute, you ' ll have to rewrite this : I'm just a blooming redbud Will you please leave me For the people who travel this highway To enjoy and see the weeping redbud . And do you know, a day or two later or about a week later, this man c ame up and said, Mrs. Buchanan, we're going to leave your redbud tree . Mr. B: She put a red ribbon around it . Mrs . B: I put a red ribbon around that redbud tree and they didn ' t take that tree . Mr . B: They left the maple too . Hrs . B: I tied this red ribbon around this maple and saved the maple, it's the only trees . Interviewer : Well maybe somebody should ' ve , tied red ribbons around all those trees out there. Mrs. B: A lot of trees , yes. Interviewer : Well that ' s really beautiful , that ' s really beautiful . Mr . B: That scene right there is over at the picnic ground at Linville They wouldn ' t have taken alot . Falls, looking up the river . Mrs. B: It ' s a fall scene. You said, well now, they said it ' s, that's on the right a way just a little bit, they may not leave it . try it. Well I said I ' m going to I ' m going to make me up a little poem and sign it the W eeping Redbud, you know . Interviewer: Really? I don ' t know i f you ' re going to be willing to do this or not , but I was hoping to get this in while I was here talking to you . �2 s I was wondering if you wo ul d be interested in playing your organ for us on the tape . Mrs . B: Yes, I will. Interviewer : Well great ! Mrs . B: What do you want me to play? Interviewer : Just your favorite thing, whatever it is you like to play best . Mr . B: Did she tell you about this organ? Interviewer: Last time I was here you know, you can tell me some more about it. Mr. B: I ' d love for you to , if you would . You had bought this organ . It was orginally in a Presbyterian church . I picked it up at a second-hand store for $15 . Mrs. B: I'm going to play Marvin ' s favorite song when you and I were young . Mr . B: And we brought it down to the Christian church and Nell used it . She plays by (music begins) , she plays by shaped notes. (Music) Mrs. B: I don ' t think I can play it . Interviewer : Yeah, but that ' s okay, you can get warmed up. Mr . B: Play my favorite tune "Farther Along". You didn ' t tape that, did you? (Music ) Interviewer : Ohl That was real beautiful. Mrs . B: We might s.ing "Farther Along" . I really appreciate that . It ' s an old timey religious song. Would you like it? Interviewer : Sure, I ' <l love it if you would . Hr . B: Fellow came out from the University of North Carolina . He was gathering up ballads one way or another , and Nell , she used to sing a lot of ballads . Fact is, she went from Berea, they took her to Chicago one time to sing ballads . Interviewer: Boy ! �26 Mrs . B: Yeah, I made the trip. Mr. B: And he promised to send her one of the records of them . But he never did . Interviewer: Really? Mr. B: He was working on his Masters degree in the University of North Carolina . Interviewer: I'd be willing to send you this tape if you ' d like . Mr. B: I went to summer school in University of North Carolina in 192 7. Then I . . . first went in 1922 . Interviewer : Boy, you ' ve been to all kinds of places. Mr. B: I went to Columbia University in 1939. Mrs. B: I Summer school in that . could write a whole history about my life . I ' ve been . . . He never did tell you about when we got married . Interviewer : No, you didn ' t. Mrs . B: Let me tell you about it. Interviewer : Okay . Mrs. B: When I was living at Crossnore with my father and mother, and I had taught school for a couple of years and so I thought I had got a little bit of money saved up, decided I ' d get married. Well the a morning I got up it was/real rainy day on the third of July . So I decided I ' d better tell my mother , she didn't know I was going to get married . So I went upstairs and I said to my mother, I said, well I guess I ' d better take a bath and get ready to go. Well she said, where you going this morning, Nell? going to get married . And she $tarted to cry . I said, I ' m And my little baby sister was ten years old and she went downstairs and she said , Pa ! Says, Nell going go to get married this morning. she ' ll be picking her a bargain too . And said, Yeah, But anyway, a little while �27 Wallace came for me . He had a real roadster car. So I went to this old Dr . Tovitt, they called him, and got my health certificate and we were married in the Baptist church in Newland. Bridges married us . A Baptist minister. And a Rev . Well we came on and so I went on down to his mother ' s and father's and I stopped and I hanged from the dress I was married in to a dress that I could travel in. So we were going on down toward, over toward Asheville, and you know we heard this awful racket under the car . So he got out and stopped the car and there was all this barb wire that was wound around the wheel and he had to get out, now we're on our honeymoon mind you, and he had to get out of the car and take that off. Well we went on in to Asheville . We stayed, I don ' t know what hotel it was, but we stayed in a hotel that night. Next morning we ' re going to the top of Mt. Mitchell, but back in those days the roads were not very good . top of Mt. Mitchell. I mean it was just a graveled road to the So I said, well I have an uncle and an aunt living ? over at Canyon, says we can't go on to Mt . Mitchell, let's go over to see Aunt ~~~~~~and Uncle Walter . Well, while we were over there visiting with them, he said, you know we ' ve got that old house back in Minneapolis and we want to sell it to you. already planned to live down around Plumtree . But Wallace had But anyway Uncle Walter said I want to sell you that house . · He ;was in the timber business . of the car. So anyway we started home and a ball bearing burnt out And we went back home and my Uncle Walter and Wallace came back to Asheville and got the bearing fixed . and got the car started on the second time. And came back Well the ball bearing went out and he said I ' ll just go back and we ' ll trade with Uncle �28 Walter . So he gave us $600 for the old car . first payment on this house . And that was the Well Uncle Walter brought us to Asheville North Carolina, and we caught a taxi and now imagine what a taxi would cost, I don ' t know what it cost . Well anyway we caught a taxi . Mr . B: It didn't cost much that time. Mrs . B: Into Spruce Pine . Mr . B: And it wasn ' t a tar road anywhere . Mrs . B: And so we came on and when we got to Spruce Pine, ·' course . . . Mr . B: Well tell them about getting sick now. Mrs . B: Oh yeah. Coming across Bull's Gap the taxi driver had to stop ' cause I got sick . The ruts were about 6 inches deep . The car just went back and forth and back and forth . Mr. B : Even with chains on . Mrs . B: And I got sick and so I had to go on to vomit on my honeymoon, now mind you . Coming on home, well I got home to his home. We stopped. His mother was a midwife . Mr . B: We got to Spruce Pine and had to hire anoLher taxi. Mrs . B: Well I did . I told her that . And anyway we came on home and got to his house down at Spear, North Carolina , and his mother was gone delivering a baby somewhere . breakfast. Well the next morning I had to get up and get And of course I was embarassed being a new bride, I was just embarassed to get breakfast for his dad and well I guess that was all that was there. So we lived there for a few days then in the meanwhile we bought this place, of course, and we moved here in August 1, 1924. So we have lived here for SS years. 0£ course we improved the house . Mr. B: We ' ve rebuilt it 2 or 3 times . This same place. �29 Mrs . B: The house was really a mess when we came here because just squatters had lived here you know . But it's been a very delightful place to live and we have enjoyed 55 years of married life here . We think it ' s beauti ful and we love to live here . Enjoy having our friends come and see us. Let ' s sing them "Farther Along". Wallace, can you . . . sing the lead, now don ' t sing bass . Mr. B: You want me to sing the lead or the bass? Mrs . B: Well can you sing the bass with it? Mr . B: Yes, I can sing the bass. Mrs. B: Do you know the words? Mr . & Mrs. B: (Singing "Farther Along") ltrs. · B : I made some mistakes in that . Mr . B: Yeah, I did too . Interviewer: That was so nice, it really was . Mrs. B: We sang it at one of our church meetings . Interviewer: You must sing a lot . Mrs . B: Yeah . Interviewer : Well that's a real nice song to sing. Mrs . B: Well anything else now you want . . . Interviewer : Well now wait . Mrs . B: That he does, he does, but he don't. Mr . B: I haven ' t got it tuned up now . Do you? I'll tell you . . Is that one of the songs you sing? That's one we sing a lot. my life. That ' s a beautiful song . Sang it down at Saint Augustine too. I . . . does somebody play the banjo here? I made three banjos, homemade in It ' s down in Florida though . bterviewer: That ' s a real nice one . Mr. B : It's just not tuned up now . Mrs . B: You'll have to redo a lot of that because we made so many mistakes . Mr. B: Way back , back in my teens, I 'd take the banjo and I had one of these I ' ve almost lost the art of tuning it. frames, it's down in Florida, that you put a mouth organ in, and I'd �30 pick the banjo and play the mouth organ . And my dad had a drum that nis dad brought back from the Civil War and I beat that drum with my foot and I ' d make the music for country dances . Play "S ourwood Mountain" and different dance tunes like that (Sings) . . . . chickens is a crowing in Sourwood Mountain. Hey !Ho '! A diddle le a day ! My pretty girl lives up in the hollars . won ' t call her . She won ' t come and I Hey ! Hoop ! A diddle le a day ! (Laughter) Interviewer: That ' s really neat . Mr . B : Not anymore . Mrs . B: They have in the high schools, clogging . Mr . B : Just in the high school , clogging . Did people have dances around here a lot? But we used to have a dance at least once a month; country dance somewhere or other . Interviewer : Where did they usually have it? Mr. B : People's houses. Mrs . B: In the olden days they did . Mr. B: Just before Nell and I was married, we took her up to Dave Vances At people ' s homes? and we had, they took. Mrs . B: Played the old Virginia reel; what they called it. Mr . B: The old Virginia reel and square dancing. Mrs. B: Course they have the more modern dances now; you know . This Avery clog team and the square dance team-they ' re right famous . Mr . B: I do a lot of work like this. Interviewer : Oh that ' s nice. Mr . B : That's chestnut . Int el!viewe r : Yeah. Mr . B: Wormy chestnut . Make things like that . What kind of wood is this? Chestnut is a thing of the past now . The wormy chestnut, I see that . . �31 p~etty. Interviewer: That ' s real Mr . B: It ' s all made out . . . I ' ve got one in my bedroom there, it ' s all made out of one plank. there . I made it in my. . in Justice Hall over When I was over there in 1935 and 36 . Interviewer : Oh! Mrs . B: Yes, he has a workshop . Mr . B: Yeah , I have . Mrs. B: He made Francis Interviewer : Do you· have any other children besides Francis? Mr . B: I got, I got credit for 3 or 4 things that I · made · on art . Mrs.B : Show you these pictures here of the girls . ~~~~~~~~ down at Daniel Christian Church . grandaughter . That's a picture made That ' s Rickyl_ our oldest You see that? Interviewer: Yes mam . Mrs . B: I bet you saw that the other day . (Tape temporarily cuts off ) Mr . B: capital of the world do you? Interviewer : Uh huh, I sure do . Hr . B: I ' d say three- fourths of the people in this county are raising shrubbery that ' s shipped all over the United States . And it ' ll continue to be in the place of raising crops to eat . They ' re going to raise shrubbery and buy their, buy their. . . what they eat . Interviewer: Uh huh . Mr . B: I used to raise ooxwoods here . I guess I sold altogether during my lifetime, at least ten thousand dollars worth of boxwoods . Interviewer: Wow ! �32 Mr. B: That's these boxwoods growing right out : here, that's where he's making his living now. He sold a big lot out, right around here the other day. Mrs. B: She asked a question what you thought this would be a urban or a (phone rings) Mr . B: It'd be a urban. The whole county will be. won't increase too much. They want to get out. The town of Newland People don't want to live in town anymore. That's the general conception of a new life going on, is to get out in the country. Interviewer: Do you think that's a good thing? Mr . B: And that's really, yes, it's good. Interviewer: Do you think these people that are moving into the area that come from cities, do you think they're going to bring a lot of the really bad things about the city with them and do the same thing all over again? Mrs . B: Yes. Indeed they are. But we've already shown that they've brought into our county a lot of things that our people didn't know about. they've brought a lot of good things, but on _the o~her . hand, been a lot of wickedness and a lot of evil that's come Now there's into our country. We wouldn't of had . . . Mr . B: Well like up here on Beech Hountain, they brought in what we used to call blind tigers where they sell whiskey. You go into blind place and get whiskey or get it by the drink or get it by the bottle. Mrs. B: And on the whole I believe that probably it's not for the betterment of the county. As I say, there are a lot of good things about it, but it's brought, it's made a different way of life. have changed . I doubt if they ~ re for the good. A lot of things �33 Interviewer : Well. Mrs . B: I mean, that ' s my opinion . I ' d~~- onl¥ my opinion . opinion of a lot of people, you can discuss with people. I was talking to J . D. Ellis over here at . Interviewer : Okay. END OF TAPE For the I know � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Appalachian Oral History Project Interviews Description An account of the resource In 1973, representatives from Appalachian State University (ASU) began the process of collecting interviews from Watauga, Avery, Ashe, and Caldwell county citizens to learn about their respective lives and gather stories. From the outset of the project, the interviewers knew that they were reaching out to the “last generation of Appalachian residents to reach maturity before the advent of radio, the last generation to maintain an oral tradition.” The goal was to create a wealth of data for historians, folklorists, musicians, sociologists, and anthropologists interested in the Appalachian Region. The project was known as the “Appalachian Oral History Project” (AOHP), and developed in a consortium with Alice Lloyd College and Lees Junior College (now Hazard County Community College) both in Kentucky, Emory and Henry College in Virginia, and ASU. Predominately funded through the National Endowment for the Humanities, the four schools by 1977 had amassed approximately 3,000 interviews. Each institution had its own director and staff. Most of the interviewers were students. Outgrowths of the project included the Mountain Memories newsletter that shared the stories collected, an advisory council, a Union Catalog, photographs collected, transcripts on microfilm, and the book Our Appalachia. Out of the 3,000 interviews between the three schools, only 663 transcripts were selected to be microfilmed. In 1978, two reels of microfilm were made available with 96 transcripts contributed by ASU. An annotated index referred to as The Appalachian Oral History Project Union Catalog was created to accompany the microfilm. The catalog is broken down into five sections starting with a subject topic index such as Civilian Conservation Corps, Coal Camps, Churches, etc. The next four sections introduced the interviewees by respective school. There was an attempt to include basic biographic information such as date of birth, location, interviewer name, length of interview, and subjects discussed. However, this information was not always consistent per school. This online project features clips from the interviews, complete transcripts, and photographs. The quality and consistency of the interviews vary due to the fact that they were done largely by students. Most of the photos are missing dates and identifying information. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Collection 111. Appalachian Oral History Project Records, 1965-1989 Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1965-1989 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed. Buchanan, Wallace Buchanan, Nell Interview Date 2/10/1976 Number of pages 33 pages Date digitized 9/23/2014 File size 16.1MB Checksum alphanumeric code cb5c8e77c4a8ab85b01168888696e91a Scanned by Tony Grady Equipment Epson Expression 10000 XL Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright for the interviews on the Appalachian State University Oral History Collection site is held by Appalachian State University. The interviews are available for free personal; non-commercial; and educational use; provided that proper citation is used (e.g. Appalachian State Collection 111. Appalachian Oral History Project Records; 1965-1989; W.L. Eury Appalachian Collection; Special Collections; Appalachian State University; Boone; NC). Any commercial use of the materials; without the written permission of the Appalachian State University; is strictly prohibited. Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived AC.111 Appalachian Oral History Project Records; 1965 - 1989 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 111_tape479_Wallace&NellBuchanan_transcript_M Title A name given to the resource Interview with Wallace & Nell Buchanan [January 10, 1976] Language A language of the resource English English Type The nature or genre of the resource Document Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Buchanan, Wallace Buchanan, Nell Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a title="Appalachian Oral History Project Interviews, 1965-1989" href="https://appstate-speccoll.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/195" target="_blank">Appalachian Oral History Project Interviews, 1965-1989</a> Subject The topic of the resource Mountain life--Appalachian Region, Southern Appalachian Training School for Teachers (N.C.) Teachers--North Carolina--Interviews Appalachians (People)--North Carolina--Watauga County Appalachians (People)--North Carolina--Mitchell County Appalachians (People)--Kentucky--Berea Buchanan, Wallace Buchanan, Nell Description An account of the resource Wallace Buchanan, born in 1892 and a resident of Minneapolis, North Carolina has been a teacher for most of his life. He talks about his early education at Berea College, his time in the air force, and his time at Appalachian Training School. It was located exactly where Appalachian State University stands today, only smaller and exclusively for training teachers. He had many jobs, namely as a history teacher at Riverside School. Air Force Appalachian Inn Appalachian State University Appalachian Training School Avery County Bakersville Beech Mountain Berea College Elk Park Farther Along George Peabody highway Hughes iron ore mine Minneapolis Mitchell County N.C. mountain snow Nashville Nell Buchanan North Carolina organ Plumtree Riverside School Sourwood Mountain Tweetsie Railroad Wallace Buchanan https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/9a3c963615579222b51fabe068e65305.pdf 3195d4056c0dc3bd2ff152d1723d8b3c PDF Text Text �NOW AVAILABLE FOR SALE: LETTERS FROM LEO: World Warn Correspondence to the Asheville Lions Club by Leo Finkelstein Patricia Beaver, Editor published by The Center for Appalachian Studies Appalachian State University Send orders to: The Center for Appalachian Studies Appalachian State University Boone, NC 28608 NAME ______________________________________ ADDRESS____________________________________ Quantity ordered___________ @ $8 each: Total _ _ _ ___ Postage and handling $1 .00 Total enclosed ______ __ �LETTERS FROM LEO WORLD WAR II CORRESPONDENCE TO THE ASHEVILLE LIONS CLUB LEO FINKELSTEIN Patricia D. Beaver, Editor Published by : The Center for Appalachian Studies AppaJachjan State University Boone, NC 28608 1997 �INTRODUCTION .... .c~c.j..,.~ l~' .Jol.A · Leo Finkelstein was born in Asheville, North Carolina in 1905, and in 191 I began school at the Montford Avenue Grammar School. He graduated from Asheville High School in 1922, where he was business manager of the Hillbilly, the school monthly magazine, as well as pianist for a musical group. From playing saxophone with the Asheville Shrine Club Maiching Band in the 1930s to piano with the Sanctimonious Seven for the Asheville Lion' s Club in the 1990s, Leo has served his community though music, humor, business acumen, and community leadership. In 1922 Leo took over management of Finkelstein's Pawnshop, a downtown Asheville institution, which Leo' s father Harry Finkelstein opened in 1903 shortly after immigrating from Lithuania. Since his retirement from Finkelstein' s in 1970, Leo has continued to be actively involved in the civic, fraternal, and religious life of the community. A member of the Asheville Lion' s Club for over sixty years, Leo has regaled his fellow Lions with his unique view oflife in Asheville and beyond. Inducted into the U.S. Army Air Corps in 1943, Leo was seen off at the bus by Lion C. Fred Brown, past president ofthe Asheville Lion' s Club and former Vice Mayor of Asheville, who advised Lejo to send letters back to the local Lion' s Club. Leo complied. What follows is his record of experiences and observations which were copied and sent back to the Asheville Lion' s Club, to be read at meetings during World War II. Following induction at Camp Croft, South Carolina, Leo endured Basic Training at Miami Beach, Florida, before being sent to Tishomingo, OkJahoma for training as an Air Force Clerk. His collected stories were recorded in a diary, given to him by Miss ~th Anderson, Leo's typing teacher at the Oklahoma College of Agriculture, where soldiers train~ to be clerks in the Air Force recei ..·ee iA&tA:IGtiett. The majority of the following stores, vignettes, and poems originated in the Philippines, where Leo served until4he final days of the war. �MY LIFE IN THE SERVICE rhe Diaxy of Leo Finkelstein 109 Lakeshore Drive Asheville, North Carolina SERVICE RECORD Transfers Spartanburg, SC Columbia , SC Miami Beach, FL Tishomingo, OK Kearns, Utah Pittsburg , CA Camp Croft Camp Jackson 414 Training Group Murray State College 501 Training Group Camp Stoneman Induction Reception Basic Training A.A.F.T.T.C. (E&O) O.R.T.C. P.O .E. (Staging San Francisco, CA New Caledonia New Caledonia Guadalcanal Los Negros 40th Ship Co. 6th Replacement Depot 6th Staging Area 394th Bomb Sq . (H) 394th Bomb Sq. (H) Wakde Noemfoor Morotai Samar Leyte Seattle, WA Fort Bragg , NC 394th Bomb Sq . 394th Bomb Sq. 394th Bomb Sq. 394th Bomb Sq. 93rd Repl. Fort Lawton P . O . E. South Pacific Novmea 5th Bomb GP (H) 13th Air Task Force F.E.A. F . F.E.A. F. F.E.A. F. F.E . A. F. P.O . E. P .O. D. Separation Aree~) Letter sent Home From ~ami (H) (H) (H) (H) January 12 , 1943 January 19, 1943 January 23, 1943 March 29, 1943 May 31 , 1943 Oct. Nov . Nov. Dec. Dec. 20, 1943 1 , 1943 23, 1943 11 , 1943 19, 1943 Auq. 20, 1944 Aug . 22 , 1944 Sept. 26, 1944 Nov. 4, 1944 March 2 , 1945 July 14 , 1945 Aug. 20, 1945 Sept. 1, 1945 Beach I am still on the sun- kissed shores of Miami Beach and have been well educated in my advanced training . I have learned six new cuss words (especially) for top Master Sergeants , how to use an electric potato peeling machine , how to go to Miami without a pass, how to stand at attention (while half asleep), how to shine my shoes with the minimum amount of energy. I have been told that I will be shot if I go AWOL or fall asleep on guard duty and will get half- shot if I drink too much whiskey (like I didn ' t know). I have had so many instructions on making beds , cleaning out toilet bowls and other domestic duties that I think I would make a better wife than a soldier. I have been taught to jump off of nine foot fences on the obstacle course and if I refused to do it - I would be locked up here. If I did things like that at home - I would be locked up there. I have been taught that if a pretty girl walks by- I c an look, think and wish, but I'm not allowed to talk or whistle at her. I have been taught to stand at attention and not move while a fly does calisthenics on my nose. This is the army Air Force. ~ From Tishomingo, Oklahoma Tishominqo was an Indian Chief who died here in the early part of the nineteenth century and t~is place has been dead ever since. This is the spot where the capitol of some Indian tribe was situated and today it is a spot where 500 soldiers are studying to be technicians in the Air Corps and at the same time improving their technique with the co-eds on the campus of this colle ge. *'***•********** �nn. ~t /\\ / / IV -~ \ My mail has been so light lately, I'm getting to t hink my BOis reaching all the way back to Asheville. --***** **'* **-lf**~~t Something happe ned to the water works in Tishomingo and the Army Officers found that the water wasn't pure so none of the soldiers can go into town until the town government gets the water works fixed. T can't imagine soldiers going to town to drink water but I guess some of t he officials are scared one of them will get drunk and take a bath in i t . .......... .... .. .......... Refore the war T thought being i n the army woul d be a thrilling adventure - but now I know Sherman was right . I Before the war I thought the Air Corps was a mechanized force - but now wonder what the Hell I 'm marching for. Before the war, I thought floors we r e to walk on - but now I 've found they are to sweep and mop on. Before the war, I thought the Asheville-Citizen was a rotten newspaper but now I enjoy reading one four days old. Before the war, I would drink a cocktail before dinner - but now I drink milk with my dinner . Before t he war, I would go to bed sometimes at 4 AM - but now I get up at 4 AM. Before the wa r, I was particular about what girl T took out - but now I'm not so particular. Before the war , I struggled over a golf course - but now I struggle over an obstacle course. Before t he war, T u sed to shine at a dance - but now I shine my shoes . Before the war, I cussed at a golf ball - but now a sergeant cusses at me because I'm not on the ball . Before the war, I didn ' t have much r eligion- but now I pray for a furlough . ****** .. *****•** In the Army you are always in a hurry to get somewhere so you ' ll have more time to wait after you get there. The obstacle course is so tough here that they take us on a nine mile hike to get limbered up so we can make it . ******"*****"**** A I reached the height of my social career in Tishomingo yesterday when my typing teacher , Miss Anderson, invited me to have dinner with her at the Payne Hotel in the heart of Tishomingo . Miss Anderson is not only the best looking lady teacher on the campus , but a nice person to t~lk to and get all the information about the r eligi ous, social, f r aternal, and political life in ~rmy �6 this county . I arrived at the Payne Hotel exactly on time - for who am I to keep a lady wait ing who invites me out to dinner and pays t he check. My first view of the interior of the hotel was depressing and to be conservative and brief with my description of this institution (founded in the stage coach days) is that it was a pain. Nevertheless, my companion was nice and the kindly smiles of an understanding teacher to a lonesome soldier helped greatly to make my evening a success. W entered the dining room with a great deal of precision and grace, e dodging some water that was leaking from the second floor through the ceiling and dripping on the dining room floor. Part of the plaster had already fallen from the ceiling and I felt surely the balance would come down at any minute. The dining room was also being u sed for a linen supply room and lumber s torao~ room. During our meal a lady would bring in dirty linen, pile it on the floor, and carry c l ean linen out. I never could figure out why all the l umber was stacked in the corner and was afraid to ask. After dinner my teacher took me for a personally conducted tour through the darkened, dirty and low-ceilinged halls to room #35 (where she lives) and behold - there T visualized her p ride and joy, a private bathroom - the only one in Tag Hotel . To be continued ... This place is thirty mi les from a telegraph office and so far from civilization that one gets awful lonesome at times. In fact o ne soldier got so lonesome that he got married on the telephone last night . This is a dry place, both in climate and drinking alcohol. It seems that Tishomingo is so dry that even the bootleggers don't sell it. ***•*********** They believe in getting married young here and I haven ' t found a single girl over 22 years of age, so I haven ' t found a suitable lady my age to take out. Would take some of the younger ones out but their papas keep shotguns and they know how to shoot straigh t out West. Many times jn my lifetime I have heard about people seeing snakes , especially at moments when more spirits were absorbed than the system could stand. This county here is very dry. In view of this fact I realized that I had not had a drink during the time I had been here - so it wasn ' t whiskey . Therefore i t must be a live snake and there it was on the barrack's floor crawling and wiggling and sticking its tongue out at me. That is not the only type pet that is found in our barracks. Just last week we discovered a couple of live frogs and now and then a stray dog will walk in to look us over . At night we are blessed with some miniature bombers to help put us to sleep. These extra large bugs are supposed to be June bugs but I know bugs couldn't grow that large in the one month of June. They gain a lot of �8 Today we we~e given a demonstration of war gases. I was told to put on my gas mask and was placed in a chamber filled with tear gas. Everything was lovely until I was instructed to t a ke the mask off and breathe the stuff which I did very reluctantly. My eyes burned , my nose burned, my throat burned and I cried and c ried and c~ied so they let me out into the fresh air . After partially r ecovering , I was informed t hat I would be s ubjected to several other popular brands of gasses and all I had to do was sniff each one (li ke a hound dog sniffs at a rabbit track) and associate the smell with something I had s melled i n civilian life. Thi s was easy and my a n alysis was as follows : Chlora-Pic knon gas smelled like corn whiskey . Phosgene gas s me lled like scotch whiskey . Chlori ne gas smelled like rye whi s key. Mustard gas s melled like bourbon whis key . Hydrogen- mustard gas smelled like otdinary coo ki ng whiskey. ****** ********* This camp is a c ross section between a conce n t ~ation camp and t h e Buncombe County c h ain gang. They keep you i n this camp a couple of months before you are sent to a combat zone . The y figure if you can live here t wo months wi thout serious complications that you s hould be able to live at any othe r point in the worl d for ten years . . ........ * .. **'It'***** It ' s so dirty here and I ' m so used to i t that if I ever get back home on a fu r lough I ' ll have to s prinkle sand in the b ed so I can sleep . We are not troubled with rats here - they can ' t live in this climate . I went to Bunny's Beer Garden l.ast night and stayed to 5 AM a nd took Bunny home . Bunny's husband is in the Navy . t tried to be faithful to t he Air Corps , but I couldn ' t find an aviator's wife who owned a beer garden. ****•***+'*+ ** ** Below is a schedule of how I s p e nt a w~ekend here: W aiti n g in line to get a pass Waiting in line to get a bus to town Waiting in line to let an MP check your pass Waiting in line to use phone to call q irl Waiting to get taxi to go after gi rl Waiting in line to get permit to buy a pint of whiskey W aitinq in line to buy whiskey Waiting in line to qet seat i n restaurant W aiting for waitr:-e!'ls to bring gin ger ale and i ce Waiting in lin e for street car to t ake girl home aiting fo r girl to make up her mind (to kiss me good-night) W Walking to bus station Explaining to 1st sergeant why 1 was 1ate getting back to c amp Resting up from Satu rday night's activities 30 min . 43 min. 9 min. 10 min . 52 min . 28 min . 27 min . 40 min . 12 min. 11 min . 02 min. 13 min. 5 min . All day Sunday The worst food in the Army Air Forces is served in the mess halls of Kearns Field, Utah. A soldier here was getti n g something to eat out of a �9 garbage can today and a Lieutenant nearby said, "Here you! Do you think you are better than the rest of the men on this field - get on in the mess hall and eat!" *************** I've had details on this post from the telephone operator on the firing range to the office boy in the Commanding Officer's office, but my most interesting detail was handed to me today when I was made "Garbage Man" for the Mess Hall. Now don't think that a garbage man ' s job is just an ordinary bit of work. To the contrary, i t takes a man who can stand gruesome odors and one who has specialized knowledge of slop and other varieties of waste. Neatly lined up outside of the kitchen of the Mess Hall are thirty-six GI garbage cans. My main duty was to see that the right stuff was put in the right can. There were certain cans designated for wet garbage, dry garbage, vegetable peelings, fruit peelings, egg shells, coffee grounds, bones, ashes and trash : You must be careful not to put coffee grounds in the slop as i t will kill the hogs. Tea leaves will make hogs very sick and if there is any broken glass in i t - it won ' t do the hogs any good. I was quite proud of myself when the K.P. Sergeant complimented me on my work. The onl y thing that worried me was that I was doing all this for the benefit of hogs and pigs. Recently deodorized, Leo I was told that every good soldier should know how to do his own laundry, so I decide that I • m going to do some wash.ing for myself. I tried to find out the best method for washing clothes but it seemed liked very soldier had a different system : After much cal cul ation and thought I start on what I think to be the correct procedure. The first thing I do is steal a bucket from the Mess Hall. Then I go to the PX and buy a box of Rinso and a bottle of Clorox. I put half the box of Rinso and half the bottle of Clorox in the bucket f illed wi th hot water and p l ace my underwear and socks therein . The directions on the box said to soak for one hour but in o r der to do a good job I figured I would put the bucket of clothes under my bed for a day or two. Everything was coming along fine until the Lieutenant came through the barracks on an inspecti on tour and saw the bucket of c l othes under my bed. I couldn ' t explain how the bucket got out of the Mess Hall or why I was doing my laundry during duty hours. The next thing I knew - I was restricted to the Post for a week. Nothing was going to stop me so I started to wash the c l othes . I found that the dye had run out of the socks and had got in the underwear and I couldn't get the dye out of the underwear or back in the socks. Therefore, I went up to t he Supply Sergeant and signed a statement of charges and got mysel f some new underwear and socks. Now I'm all washed up trying to wash my own washing. *************** rrom Ca~~p Ston..aan, CA I can't tell you where I ' m at because the censor wouldn't like it. I can't tell you what kind of clothes I've been issued because you would �10 know where I was going. I can't tell you about ~he camp because i ~s aga ins~ ~he rules . I can't tell you about my equipment because it would jeopardize my security. I can tell you this though - I had a date with a girl by the name of Sylvia who used ~o live in Chicago, who is now living in Los Angeles and who is visiting some friends in a city near here and she is just as sweet as ever. *************** The PX here reminds me of a country store with a night club atmosphere . You can buy anythi ng from beer to buttons with pret~y littl e teen-age girls to serve you. At very reasonable prices you can have coffee, doughnuts, cakes, sandwiches, drinks or ice cream, a gift for mother, a souvenir for sister, a can of shoe polish, a bottle of ink, a bath towel or your favorite pipe tobacco : A nickelodeon bell ows forth music in one corner whi le a group of soldiers are singing favorite songs in another. A Lieutenant-Colonel walks in without a neck tie. A captain is talking to a private in a friendly manner . A sergeant is conversing with a smiling WAC. Here is the common meeting ground of our f i ghting men and women - a last gathering place on ~heir nati ve soil . Soon we will be bound for strange lands and new assignments. *************** Pre. Boat on Paei.~ic oa.an Here I am on a boat on the Pacific Ocean. While I don't have the accommodations of a Cook's tour, I can see the same scenery that many people pay thousands of dollars to see (ocean and sky). The sleeping quarters are a little crowded and the bunks are so close to each other that many times I wake up with another guy's foot in my face or his knee in my stomach. The latrine is also a little crowded. Traffic is so heavy inside (if you can get in ) that it would make a New York traffic cop crazy trying to keep things st~aight. If you ever have to go, you got to go about an hour before you think you got to go so you will get there in time to go - then it takes about twenty minutes to get from where you go to the wash basin . Believe me, Firestone, if I could go out to your cabin for a month and have the privy at my disposal and that creek with fresh mountain water to do my laundry in - I'd be the happiest man in the world . *************** Here I am on an island in the South Pacific with nothing to write about. I can't write about the weather , I can't say whether it's hot or cold, rainy or dry. I can't tell the name of the island or the name of any towns near here or even if there are any towns on the island. I can't tell you if the country has mountains or plains or desert lands. I c a n't even tell you the col or of the soil, I can't tell you about the animal life, the birds; the fish or the insects . I can't tell you if the natives are white or black or yellow. I can ' t tell you what language the y speak or what country owns the island. I can't tell you if we are near an ocean, a river or a lake. I can't tel l you about the military personnel or equipment : I can't tell you about my duties . I can't tell you anything that would demoralize the civilians back home - so I'll close. �I want to tell you a story about a farmer's daughter on an island in the south Pacific . While out walking yesterday I stopped at the farmer's house and bought some cake and pie from the farmer's daughter. I asked her about some music and she brought out an ant~que model Victrola with some records. I thought I would hear some music with a South Pacific rhythm but instead it was some good old North Carolina mountain music played by a hillbilly band. Something always happens to remind me of home - damn it. J'roa Gu.clac•nel Mosquitos are big here. One lit in the runway and they put seventy gallons of gas in it before they found out it wasn't a P-38. *************** Back home it was said that money isn't everything in life. over here it might be said that money isn't anything in life. There is no place to spend it and nothing to buy. A free movie at night is the height of our entertainment. A bottle of beer once a week is the extent of our drinking. We look forward to mail call and chow. Mail from home is our greatest morale booster. On the walls of our living quarters are the pictures of a girl back home, a favorite movie star or maybe a scantly clad native girl. We see strange animals, lizards, and insects and often wonder why they like to crawl in bed with us. We search the region for souvenirs left by the Japs. We are visited by natives who wear a towel where their pants ought to be. We work hard, eat plenty and sleep well. There is no complaining here - we are just one big happy family. We have moved into our new wigwam known as "The Southside Social and Society Club, South Pacific Branch, Incorporated." Believe me it is a masterful piece of architecture in solid mahogany. Our foundation is made of empty gasoline barrels. our roof is made of empty bomb box tins. We got our lumber from an old torn down latrine. We did steal a few good boards after dark when nobody was looking. Our light sockets are home made out of airplane parts . We also have various pieces of antique furniture made out of shipping boxes picked up at the mess hall. We have a front porch. Our roof don't leak (very much). The entire frame-work of our house is covered with mosquito netting and at a distance the shack appears to be a huge bird cage with monkeys running around in it. Anyhow its home and it is good to know that we again have a place to call our own. *************** "Spot is a dog - a white dog with one black spot over his right eye. Spot is the mascot of a certain crew who maintained a certain airplane at a certain field in the South Pacific. Spot knew 'his' airplane - the airplane his crew worked on. Spot would ride out on the bus to the field every morning and would jump off at the bunker on which his airplane was parked. He knew the location of his plane just like a civilian dog would know the location of its home. He stayed by his a.irplane in all kinds of weather and admired the splendid way his crew kept the ship in shape. Not long ago the airplane didn't return from a flight therefore the crew didn't go out to the field. Spot would ride out to the field on the bus as usual every morning and would jump off at the bunker that had held his plane. For many days that followed I could see Spot standing there, a l one, on the empty bunker, waiting for his airplane to come home. *************** �12 I discovered a new animal today. It was a lizard, four feet long , running around in my front yard . The reptile looked like an alligator but it didn ' t have the same disposition . It was supposed to be harmless but he didn ' t look very sociable to me. His skin looked like it would make a good traveling bag but since I wasn't going anywhere , I didn ' t try to capture the thing. He finally ran down in my fox hole and I am hopin g , in the event I have to use that fox hole some night, that he won ' t be there with a wife and family. Anyhow, I am looking forward to the time when I can get home, where there is nothing to bother me but house flies , bumble bees and ants . *************** This is a dehydrated war . our breakfast is made at the mess hall with a powder: they mix with water. 0ut of this mixture comes hot cakes , pan cakes, flat-jacks and wheat cakes and t hey all taste alike . One gallon of dehydrated potato powder is mixed with water and out comes five gallons of mashed potatoes without mashing them. The dehydrated eggs at the mess hall have a sign on them reading " eggs" because they don ' t look like eggs or taste like eggs. The dehydrated milk turns out to be dark grey a nd putting i t in the dehydrated coffee keeps you from getting an infection from the stuff . The dehydrated lemonade could be used for battery acid but we use it mostly for washing our mess kits. If somebody would only invent dehydrated whiskey - that would be a great a contribution to the war effort. Our mail is even dehydrated into V-mail. Yes, everything is dehydrated around here except the weather . I am now a politician. of his tribe. I was the cause of a native being made " chief " This is how it happened. A certain native I called "Joe" would come over to my shack to visit me and even though he taiked very ~ittle English, I found out from him much about his life and the customs of his people . These poor devils work for ten cents a day. They sign up for a year and are paid in full at the end of their contract. Joe always admired a larqe knife that I had . This knife was sent to me from home, being one that I had jn my collection, hanging on the wall of my bar room. Every time I showed it to Joe a big smile would come over his face , his snow white teeth would shine like pearls, his eyes gleamed with fire and he would say over and over, " Nice, I like. Nice, I like! " He would carefully caress the etched figure of a lion on the blade and would gaze for minutes at his image on the shiny steeL One day Joe came over to see me . He had five American dollar bills wra pped in an old cloth bag. He offered me the five dollars and his war club for my knife. f traded wi t h h im and he left my shack the happiest man I've ever looked upon. I followed him over to the native village and there the whole tribe gathered around and made him chief because of his ability to acquire such a wonderful knife. Never would I have thought, when I nailed that knife to the wal l of my bar at home, that someday it wou ld be the cause of a man being made chief of a native tribe on an island in the South Pacific. *************** There are no sheets, no mattresses, no pillows, no springs on my cot but when I ~. ay down to go to sleep I acquire a feeling of comfort and contentment . Sometimes I gaze at the stars shining in the t ropical heavens . Other times I listen to the rain beating down on the tin roof . There are no pains , no nerves, no responsibilities , no vain regrets, no anticipation of gathering difficulties, no financial probJems to di·sturb my hard earned slumber. I wake up in the morning and look at the mountains around me. Their lofty peaks �13 me of the mountains at h ome . Th is is a wo nderfu l place to lead a n easy ci f c but frankly I would not hesitate to accept a n y opportun ity to go back to my civilian life once again . ·:e.~nd ********'*** **** Parts of this a r ea are cov ered wi th ;ungle vegetation. Enormous tree trunks covered with s nake like vines , stran ge flowers and inhabited by screeching parrots tower above the semisolid mass of bamboo , palms , ferns , writhing roots , creepi ng l izards a nd t housands of energetic grasshoppers . There are hellgrammites and s piders to be had on the island but personally I could do well without t hem, especially after seei n g t he effects of their bites. *********"" ••••* Letters , letters , letters - that ' s t he only way I have to kee p in touch with the old country (the United States) and what a problem! Lette r s to my mother must be dignified and cheerful. Letters to my f r aternal brothers, the police department and some of the girls I used to go with don ' t have to b e so dignified. Letters to the Lions Club must be interesting and to the point. Letters to my attorney, accountant , and manager should eKpress my appreciation for their faithful services even though I ' m wonder ing if t hey a re o n the job . In my letters to my Rabbi , I try to be rel igious . In my lette rs to my social club, I try to be a beer drinker and an expert ca rd player . Letters to my best girl must be affection ate even t hough I t h i n k she is going out with a couple of sergeants. In my letters to my banker I am optimistic , cautious and hopeful . In all my letters I can ' t say anything that would demoralize the people at home because I know they are having a tough time with ration points , wh iskey shortages, War Bond Drives and taKes . Finally, T have to please the censor but he has an advantage over you - he can cut out what h e don't like . Foxes don ' t live in a fox hole. It ' s a place we run in, crawl in, fall in, sl ide in, scramble in o r jump in in event of an air raid. Mack and T got orders to fill in an old one by our shack . Mack is lazy as Hell and since I was getting up in years we decided to get a couple of natives to do the job . Mack went over to the native village a nd negotiated for the job, usi ng two bucks of mine for payment, which T furnished very reluctantly. W hen the natives started to fill the hole with dirt , a snake , five feet long , ran out . Mack, being a country boy, picked up the snake by its tail and Powers (a butcher in civilian life) , chopped his head off with an axe before I stopped running. The neKt thing to come out was a ground rat. One of the natives caught him with his bare hands and killed it before I could stop run ning . The next thir.gs to come out were four centipedes about a foot long apiece. One bite from one of these huge worms and you run for the dispensary as fast as you ca n, cussing your draft board ail along the way with words unfit to write. The fox hole is now filled up so guess I'll take a nap because I'm tired out from runnJ.ng. •+ ............ ....., .... .., ... . From Los Neqros-Admdralty Islands Prior to my induction i~ the army I considered myself a respectable upright citizen of Buncombe County , North Carolina . I was always honest except for a few times during my childhood days when I swiped onions from Mrs . Roberts ' garden, stole an apple from Mr. Book ' s grocery store and helped myself to all the cherries I could eat from a n eighbor's cherry tree . My ch~ldhood habits started again the other day when I volunteered (by �14 request) to help unload several barges of beer. Even though our secret weapons are not guarded , each barge of beer has armed guards. I found that if I accidentally dropped a case of beer that sometimes several bottles would fall out and in gathering up these bottles sometimes they accidentally got inside my shirt and as long as they were inside my shirt , I didn ' t see any reason not to drink them . Do you think I ' ll go to Hell for this? ********** * **** On this beautiful (to some people) island in the Adrniralt¥ Group one can sit under a swaying palm tree (until a coconut falls and bounces off your head) and admire the sun- kissed shores (through sun glasses to keep from going blind). You may breathe deeply of the fresh air (saturated with the smell of st3gnant salt water) and gaze at the moon (providing you can see t h rough ¥OUr mosquito net). In the daytime you can enjoy the cool refres h ing rains (if you don't mind getting as wet as a drowned r at) . In the evenin gs i t ' s your privilege to see a new movie featuring William s . Hart or Fatty Arbuckle and go back to your tent knowing you will have a good night ' s sleep (providing you take sleeping pills) . It is thrilling to search the jungle for souvenirs (if you don ' t mind picking up booby traps). If you get the tooth ache you can go to the dentist . If you don ' t feel like working you can go on sick call . If you get homesick you can go see the chaplain. This is an ideal place to be . Every morning at breakfast time I am greeted by " Porkie. " He is a little pig and a cute little pig at that . He could be part dog because he looks up at me and wags his tail. He could be part wild boar because he pushes me around with h is nose . Anyhow in this G·o dforsaken country I welcome most any kind of a friend and believe me Porkie is my friend because he will let me pet him and feed him . Nobody knows where Porkie carne from . Maybe the Japs left him here or maybe he wandered down into the camp from the hills. There have been some suggestions about killing Porkie and roasting h im over a fire but I don ' t think there is any danger of that happening because we can ' t eat Porkie and have him too . ***"~~"**'********• Sometime ago while I was on a troop transport a warning came over the loud speaker than a Jap battleship and two destroyers had been sighted . I was playing checkers , some other guys were playing cards , some reading . You could hear a number of wise cracks about the situation but nobody seemed to be disturbed . We were all in the same boat and i t appeared that regardless of our religious beliefs, political opinions , social or financial standings in civilian life, that being in the same boat under these conditions united us in the closest bonds of fellowsh ip . True this war has made soldiers of us but in (doing so it has not destroyed that individuality, humor and tolerance we possessed . In my opinion it has cemented firmer in us these necessities of a peaceful democratic society . (Adapted from an instruction booklet) Suppose you got lost in the jungle . You would have nothing to worry about as far as food is concerned . You may eat , with safety, anything that the monkeys eat and you can even eat the monkeys. They are considered a delicacy by the natives. �15 More than likely you would start your day off with a breakfast of grasshoppers. The legs and wings pulled off , toasted on the end of a stick or fried in coconut oil, they are not at all displeasing to the taste. Of course if you dcn't like grasshoppers you could eat winged ants , or termites particularly the queens and the eggs of ants . For dinner I would suggest roasted rat smothered with lizard tails . Rats are plentiful and have a taste similar to large fruit bats. Lizards are also plentiful and the meat from the hindquarters is preferred. A nice seaweed salad would be appropriate. Strangely enough seaweeds are not very salty and their water content is fairly fresh. In general, the pink, purple and the reddish or green seaweeds are best. For dessert I would recommend water lilies with chopped white grub worms. Supper should be your biggest meal. You could start out with snake meat sliced li ke bologna, wild sweet potato chips and fern tips. All s nakes are aood to eat - even the poisonous ones , if the head is cut off immediately after capture . Your soup could be turtle soup season ed with bamboo shoots and the buds of palm trees . A salad of bananas and figs would go good i f you could find some. Your main course may be porcupine stew or broiled kangaroo steaks with hard boiled bird eggs on the side. Seriously speaking all the items I have mentioned in this letter are edible and you don't need any ration points to get them. Was just thinking what i t would be like to have an Asheville Social Club here. To begin with you wouldn't have a modern building like the one at home. It would be a frame building covered with n etting or straw. The structur e wouldn ' t need a heating plant because we have an abundance of that here. You wouldn ' t be able to sell beer. The members would have to drink chlorinated river water and like it . The poker players wouldn't be able to concentrate on their hands as the roar of airplanes overhead would disturb them. You wouldn't be able to call a taxi to go home. You would have to wa lk - maybe in some pretty deep mud. You couldn't hold a dance as there are no women to dance with . The rummy players would have to be satisfied with old dilapidated cards as new ones are rare. The trustees would hav~ no worries since there is no place to spend any money. There would be one advantage of havi ng the Club here - you guys wouldn't have your wives calling you up at 1 AM to come home. *************** I got caught with my pants down. I went into the latrine this morning to enjoy a good smoke and to read the funnies. Gracefully, I made myself as comfortable as possible on the GI equipment therein, relaxing and watching the flies , red ants, and lizards playing football , follow-the-leader , and other games on the rafters and walls . Suddenly, I noticed a spider sitting right beside me - not an ordinary one with wire size legs , but one whose size reminded me of the lobsters I used to eat at home, and whose legs reminded me of those of Gloria Swanson . The gruesome and monstrous creature crawled slowly toward me and J. had no trouble doing my duty - it scared it out of me. In order that you might become acquainted with my dai ly routine here , I am listing activities below: 6 AM Wake up. Complain about the heat. Shake my shoes to see if any centipedes are parked inside . Put on my clothes . 6 : 0 4 AM Think about washing my hands but decide it is too much trouble so I start for chow. �16 6 : 06 AM Look for Porkie (the pet pig) but he don't seem to be around G~ess he is still asleep - the l ueky hog. yet. 6 : 15AM After a short argument I get the cook to turn my egg over becau se I don't li ke it half done . 6 : 35 AM wash my mess kit and complain about the heat . I Go back to my tent . 6 :4 0AM decide to postpone the job . boo ks like it n eeds clean i ng up bu t 6 :41 AM Lay down on my cot and read a f e w pages of a wild west story . 7 : 10 AM Complain about the h eat. 7:30 AM Cl imb on a GT truc k and ride ou t to my office at the field. The truck jars so much i t almost shakes my kidneys loose . 7 :4 5 AM Arrive at my office (a tent) and dust off the furniture . I don' t have to s weep the floor because it is a dirt floor and it don ' t do no good to s weep t he d irt off of d i rt. 8 : 00 AM Sgt . Luec k comes in singing. Can ' t imagine why he is singing so early i n the morning. I soon find out the reason - he made Staff Sergeant on a new rating list . Sgt . Lueck says that I didn ' t make C::orporal on t he n e w list: 8 : 05 AM because the squ adron is lou sy with corporals and some of them will have to die , transfer, go home or get promoted before I cou l d get another stripe . Capt . Gardn e r comes in and offers S/Sgt. Lueck congratulations 8 : 20AM a nd me h is sympathy . He tells me t hat h e d i d h is b e st: to get me a rati ng a n d he thin ks he will be able to push me up n e xt time. 9 : 00 AM Pfc . Runnels comes in a nd wants to know if I ma de corporal. W hen he found o u t I didn't he s uggested I e nter a complaint . I explained that I wasn' t makin g the a rmy my ca r eer and it didn't make mue h difference one way or another. do the same thing I d i d at 7 : 10AM. 10 : 00 AM I 11 : 00 AM Leave t h e field for the camp area in the same kidney-shaking 11 : 15 AM Arrive at the camp area . truck . 11 : 20 AM Stop at the PX and since they were sold o u t of candy, cookies and food , I didn ' t buy anything. 11 : 31 AM Thought that I would wash up but I go to chow instead. 11 : 59 AM Lay down on my cot fo r my noon time nap. heat and fall asleep . Complain abou t the 1 : 30 PM 1 : 45PM that I Wake up and j ump on the truck going back to the field . Arrive at the offiee a nd it is so hot I take my s h irt off . 1 :47 PM The flies , using my back for a landing field , worry me so much put my shirt back on . 2 : 10 PM Some pilot does a buzz job with his p l ane over ~y tent a nd I �17 go out to see if the tops of the coconut trees are still there. 3 : 00 PM I do the same thing I did at 10 AM only twice as much! 4:00 PM My day's work done. I hop on the truck for the camp area . Caught one of the new easy riding trucks wi th eight wheels and no spring. 4:20 PM Went by the mail room for my mail which didn ' t arrive. 4:30 PM Against my better judgement I took a shower. 5:00 PM Chow. 5:15 PM Write letters. 7 : 00 PM Moving picture sta r ts . previous occasions , I go see it again. Since I ' ve seen i t on only three 10 : 00 PM Lights out . Discussion of various topics goes on between the members of the tent. The subjects under discussion will be omitted for the benefit of any person under eight years of age who might read this. In this area we have the Army Air Forces and the United States Navy. I am in the Army Air Forces and my old friend , Harry Murdock, former assistant circulation manager of the Asheville Times, is in the Navy. Now, we see each other often , and in order to show how much the Navy will cooperate with the Army , Harry agreed to procure for me an item that the Navy has and the Army has not. (The method of obtai n i ng this item will not be revealed at t his time . ) I had not looked upon one of these luxuries for nine m onths and when he brought it to me, it was too delightful to d~scribe - too wonderful to believe . It was more welcome than an umbrella in t he rain, an ice cold drink on a hot day or a fur coat by a chorus girl. There wa s never such beauty in the mountains of western North Carolina at autumn time - no such glamour in a sunset on the ocean or a bathing beauty content. It was more invigorating than a scotch and soda or a banana split. Never before had I bestowed upon me such a gift and now when I go to sleep on that second hand "Navy issue " mattress , I ' ll dream of days to come when I can be home again . **************• Dear Mom: When I try to eat this GI food, T think of how I ate at home - it ' s then I think of you dear mom. When I look at my floor of dirt , I think of how the floors at home were so shiny and clean - it ' s then I think of you dear Mom. When I try to go to bed at night, T think of the soft bed T had at home with clean sheets and clean pillow cases - it ' s then I think of you dear Mom. When I have the toothache and nobody here seem to care - it ' s then I think of you dear Mom. When buttons c ome off I try to sew them on - it ' s then T think of you cear M om. Yo u were my cook, my nurse, my advisor, and my teacher and now when I n eed o ne of these - it's then I think of you dear Mom . �18 '**************'* If you should become ill all you would have to do is call the doctor and h e usually fixes you up. A sick airplan e is a different story . To begin with t h ere is a c rew who makes general repairs on t he ship . Besides t h is crew there are propeller specialists , engine specialists , hydraulic specialists , bomb-sight specialists , men who specialize in changing engines , radio men who repair the radios , a tire c h a nge departme n t , a section that looks after parachutes, life rafts , emergency rations , oxygen bottles and fire e x tinguishers , a supply department for parts needed, a refuel u n it to service the ships with gas and oil , inst r ument specialists , welders , sheet metal men , electrical experts , painters , ordnance men to load bombs, armamen t men to look after the guns, carburetor specialists , guards to guard the planes , a clerical staff to keep the records, inspectors , crew chiefs to supervise the crews, flight chiefs to supervise the cre\ol chiefs a nd line chiefs to sup ervise the flig h t c h iefs . Aren ' t you happy t h at you do not requi r e as muc h atten tio n as a n airplane to keep you i n shape? •• ••*********** Over here, far a way from home , I think a lot a nd what do you think I think about? First of all , I think a good deal about my family , my loved o n es and my friends I left behind . ountain, Pack Square , Vance M onument , Mom's I also think abo ut Sunset M cooking , the shiny floors i n my hous e - t he gr~en grass i n the yard. Happenings that didn ' t seem important at the time now seem to be great events . I think of the time when I was in the second grade of grammar school and stole an apple from M . Book's Grocery Store on Cherry S treet . I remember r the fjrst licking my daddy gave me for throwing a rock at my sister- he s h ook me so hard that the cuff links fell out of my shi r t sleeves and I never could find them . I thi n k about the first time I went fish ing and caught a fish. I remember the time I went hunting , killed a deer, and was s orry that I did it. T t h ink about my golf games at Beaver Lake. I can recall the ti me J almost had a fight with Dr . Robinson at a Temple Club meeting. I think of the time I beat John Vance i n an e l ection for trustee of t h e Elks Lodge. M fondest y memories are of the c h ildren around town who called me "Uncle Leo. " I think about the Christmas day whe n I played Santa Claus with the members o ·f the Lions Club at the Salvation Army Chapel . I think of the n ight that I , a bachelor, presided at a Father and Son Banquet at Congregation Be th-HaTephila . I think very little of the materialistic things I left behind. I realize now that the important things in my lifetime - the things that mean the most to me now were just little things , j u st everyday happenings. •****""********* Corporal Mark is a great g u y and that is why t like to do a favor fo r him if I can . Well, I am the guy who makes up the de t ail list and Corporal Mark requested that I put hi.m on the roving guard detail. Now, a r oving guard has a comparatively easy job . He gets a jeep , rides around all night and sees that no one steals one of our heavy bombers (weight 60 , 000 pounds). Corporal Mark is very efficient in his guarding because he goes beyond the usual call of duty and guards, not only the bombers , but the mess hall and other places where food and supplies are stored. Corporal Mark is very successful in �19 obtaining various types of edibles while on guard duty and during the early morning hours h e and I devour this food wi t h a great deal of pleasure and satisfaction to our always hungry stomachs. Now Corporal Mark is an upright and honest fellow and T think he was getting the idea that we weren ' t justly e n titled to the extra stuff to eat . That idea soon vanished because I told him about the amount of taxes the government was hitting me for while I was over here fighting for world peace so we decided that we could go on procuring this nourishment without hesitation and with a clean conscience. ** * ************ From Waltda , New Guinea I Wanna Go Home Here T ~m ~n enli~ted man , Getting along the best I can, The officers h ave stea k while I eat Spam, I wanna go home. W omen I c ~ave the~e is no doub t , Can ' t have nurses here about, Because the officers take them out , I wanna go home. M n like me will get the blues, e No whiskey for us a nd that ain ' t news, Because the officers get all the booze , I wanna go home. I can ' t get a furlough regulations say, I can ' t rest and I can't play, But the officer s manage to find a way, I wanna go home. *****'"'**** .. **** The Engineering Office sent sergeant Reville and me over to the other side of the field to get a new bomber for our squadron. I sure felt important when the fellow over there asked me to sign a receipt for the ship. Can you imagine Pfc. Finkelstein signing for $250 , 000 worth of airplane? I assure you it was less trouble for me to get that airplan e than it would be for you to kiss a bride at a wedding . I climbed up in the pilot ' s cockpit while Sergeant Reville hooked his eletrac to the nose wheel of the plane . Now Sergeant Reville can pull these 60 , 000 pound monsters around the field with his eletrac just like a baby pulls a wagon around the living room and knocks over all the furniture only Sergeant Reville never knocks anything over . He pulled me and the airplane down the taxi strip to our area where I stopped the gasoline truck and said, " Hey Corporal , fill her up . I think she will take about 3000 gallons. " As he was filling it up I recalled the time when I was home on my furlough and needed a little extra gasoline to drive my girl up to my favorite parking place on Beaucatcher Mounta in and return home (at a decent hour - of course) . Well, I went to the rationing board and they would only give me five gallons - the stingy devils. Wish they could see me now getting 3100 gallons. The only trouble over here is that I got no automobile and no girl to drive up a mountain. ******* .................. . Thousands of Japs had landed , �20 Near the land of the rising sun , On an island in the Pacific , They had nowhere else to run . Now on this tiny island, A good size town was found , The Japs - they took it over, And wandered all around. Our bombers got their orders, And took off on the mission, To save the town if possible, And bomb the Jap position. One bombardier was fearless, And always on the ball, This flight he made a grave mistake , ith no excuse at all . W He aimed right at the target, He carefully fjxed his sight, He missed the Jap position, Hit a house with a big red light. Now when we take that island, And give the Japs a trimmin ', W 'll still be cussin ' the bombardier, e Who blew up all the women . ************** It all started when I received one of Finkelstein's $7;95 rebuilt watches. A guy offered me an old radio and twenty- five dollars in cash for it and I traded . Money is almost useless over here but I managed to give the twenty-five dollars to another guy who gave me a half gallon of home-made drinking beverage wh ich I think was made out of fe~ented canned corn and 100 octane gasoline. I pooled my half-gallon of imitation "Carolina corn " with a fellow who had a case of beer and we proceeded to drink it all up but he passed out before we finished and I had ten cans of beer left on my hands as my share of t h e party . I traded the beer for a pipe , ten packages of tobacco , a pocket knife and a fountain pen. I traded the knife for a flashlig ht and three cans of beans. I ate the three cans of beans and traded the fountain pen for an electric light socket , a cigarette lighter and two dollars. I invested the t wo dollars i n a crap game, won eight dollars, took the proceeds and bought a radio tube to fix my radio. I traded the radio for a boat which later sank. I traded three packages of tobacco for four cigars and three air mail stamps . I smoked the cigars and used the three air mail stamps to write to three friends back i n t he States requesting from each a box of food. Now, when and if I receive these boxes of food , I will be able to render to you a complete financial statement as to how I came out on the watch. ******* * *•***** Here in the jungle we don ' t have houses fo r house flies to live i n but we do have house flies . These flies look like the flies at home ~who have survived the fly swatter , but they don't lead the same kind of life. They follow us wherever we go but they don't follow us to the mess hall because they don't like the Gl food t he mess sergeant slings at us no more than we do. Once in awhile, if a fly gets about half starved, he will fly around the mess hall looking for something to eat . They are persistent devils and they won ' t ~ �21 be shoo'd away like the American flies. Quring din ner one made eighteen dives at my mess kit before I got him. Many of these brave flies , who dare eat our food, just turn over on their backs after the first bite , kick their legs up in the air and die. It ' s a rough war- even for flies . The war seems to be getting longer every day. *************** From Noamfoor Starvin ' Marvin's real name is Sgt . Marvin Binion but we call him Starvin ' Marvin because he never gets enough to eat. In fact none of us get enough to eat - only he complains about it more than we do. Now Starvin' Marvin has given everybody in our tent a name . Luke the Droop is really Sgt. Lueck, chief engineering clerk. Ed the Red is a crew chief on an airplane. Herman the German is chief clerk in Tech Supply and Leo the Hero is nobody else but me, an ordinary clerk who is fed up with the setup. Luke the Droop has been overseas thirty months and expects to go back to the States on the "Rotation Plan" only i t hasn't rotated far enough to reach him yet. on this account he is very cautious during air raids because he figures he is going home soon and he wants to get there in good shape . One night Hoim the Woim (which is a short name for Herman the German) woke us up yelling "Air Raid. " Luke the Droop was dressed and in a fox hole before any of us got out of bed. By the time I put on my shoes and grabbed my clothes everybody was gone including Ed the Red who moves very slowly especially when it comes to doing any work on his airplane. I wandered out of the tent , the moon was shining brightly and everything seemed peaceful to me . It wasn ' t peaceful long and I beat five guys to a jeep and crawled under it. It was my first air raid experience and now I imagine I ' l l be know as " Foxhole Finkelstein" instead of Leo the Hero . ************** ... Written from Morotai My Helmet My helmet is a useful thing , To wear upon my head, It's made of good materials , And feels almost like lead . My helmet makes a wash bowl, I can use it any place , I fill it up with water, And wash my hands and face. My fox hole roof is awful low, I can ' t stand up in there, So I put my helmet on the floor , And use i t for a chair . Now if I want a ba5ket, To hang down from my bunk, �22 It sure does make a lovely thing, To hold all kinds of junk. Now if I ' m sentimental , For flowers and that rot , I fill it up with good old dirt, ~nd I got a flowe r pot. Now if I want to take a nap, Beneath a weeping willow, I place it down upon the ground , And U5e i t tor a pillow. No w when I ligh t a candle , need a candlestick , I tur n the helmet upsid e down, It always does t h e t r ick . ~d Now when my socks get di r ty , the odor isn ' t right , I fill the thing with soapy water, ~nd let them soak all njght . ~d Now hard boiled eggs are something , I always did admire, So I fill the helmet full of water , ~nd put them on the fire. Now when we had a dim out, There ' s no use to be afraid , I put the helmet on the light , And use i t for a shade . Now when this war is over, (I ' ve often heard it said) , The helmet ' ll be a useful thing , To keep beneath the bed. finis ***********•*** Littl e Wacs Real cute They want Parachute. In c hute Silk cloth Real cl~a n Very so ft. Love pilots With skill Get c hutes ~t will. Take back To shanties Make many �23 Pair panties . Interesting facts about Life on the South Pacific Islands with the Air forces: A whiskey still can be made out of hydraulic tubing , an oxygen tank and other airplane parts. Corn whiskey can be made out of fermen ted canned co rn . American whiskey may be bought from S35 to S60 per quart. A motor boat can be con structed from two airplane belly tanks and a small power unit. The silk cloth in parachutes may be used to make panties for nurses and Wacs . All natives are friendly - there are no cannibals. In trading with the n a tives you can get more with a Bible or a piece of cloth tha n you can get with money or jewelry. 100 octane gasoline may be used for cigarette lighter fluid. Gasoline is easier to procure than water. Sometimes it requires written permission to get five gallons of wate r for laundry purposes . Gasoline is available in any quantity for any purpose. There are more sna kes per square mile in the mountains of North Ca rolina than in the j ungle. It is safer in a fox hole during a n air raid than riding in a n automobile back home wi t h you r wife drivi ng it . ********* .. *'**** All natives are friendly i n these parts. There are no cannibals . That's more than I can say for the tax collector back home . Taking a bath o u t of a helmet is more complicated than you thi nk. Nevertheless , the job can be done without exerting too much effort if t he following di r ections are complied with: Never try to sit in the helmet. P1ace it o n a corne r p o l e o f a tent a nd stand beside it . Buckle the c h in strap and let i t h a ng down like a flower basket. rill t he helmet full of water . Get the water i n a legitimate manner if you can, otherwise steal it from the mess hall or the officer ' ~ showers there is ~J ways plenty there . Place a copy of you r home town n e wspaper on the ground (the Sunday edition is best because i t has more pages and makes a softer bath mat) . Take a cake of soap and using the water in the helmet lather up from feet to head or head to feet - it don't make no difference. Before the soap drjes , fill the helmet with fresh water and pour ove r top of head. This is repeated until all the soap is washed off. If the water is too cold , there is nothing you can do about it . Dry with a towel either clean or dirty. Shake all a nts and bugs out of towel before using. In the event of an air ra1d during the p r ocess of taking the bath , go to your fox hol e at o nce. ALter the " all clear" start all over from the beginni ng. �24 ************ .. ** A j ungle snake, on Guadalcanal , Went crawling over , To see his gal. He found his gal, Did not feel fit , She had a cold, That wouldn't quit. And every time, That she would cough , The jungle snake , Would get hissed off . Master Sergeant Johnson and I started the evening off by opening a can of salmon a nd ended up by opening a gold mine or at least we planned to open o n e after the war. Sergeant Johnson, after looki ng at the label on t he above mentioned salmon can, told me that he was once foreman of the cannery in Alaska that canned this particular can of salmon. He insisted on telling me about the different species of salmon , the white salmon , the pink salmon and I forgot the other colors he mentioned. Anyway I wasn ' t i nterested in the colors of salmon in Alaska because I was hungry and the only salmon I was i nterested in at that particular time was the salmon in the can . In order to be sure we wouldn ' t get poisoned by the salmon, we took several shots of Jungle Juice before and after eating the fish . For you r information Jungle Juice is made of 190 proof medical alcohol, colored and flavored with burnt sugar and diluted w.itl'l a small quantity of water. Jungle Juice seems to build up conversation and the conversation drifted all around Alaska. We finally got on the subject of gold and gold mi nes. According to what Sgt. Johnson said , he had done a goodly amoun t of gold hunting in Alaska and was well versed in mineralogy . We figured we could buy a seaplane after the war from the Navy at a fraction of the original cost , fly to Alaska, land on the many i naccessible lakes , pan their shores for gold and get rich quick (if the income tax man don ' t find us) . I have written all my friends back horne offering to sell them stock in the Finkelstein- Johnson Expedition to Alaska. Smoky Joe's horne is just a little bit south of Asheville, North carolina. He is one of the cooks down at our Mess Hall, a good guy, and a GI who can sympathize with all the other G.Is who have to eat the food he prepares. Before the war Smoky Joe owned a Load house on the highway going south from Asheville, and, after talking with him I found that I had patronized his institution on numerous occasions during my younger years . Since we were practically neighbors in eivilia n life 1 we felt that we should eontinue over here as good neighbors and so we are . There is no better friend in the Army than a cook because when you get hungry - he is the only man who can help you out . In passing , I might mention that Smoky Joe, Starvin' Marvin and I have on numerous i nstances enjoyed eating surplus stoeks of food from the M ess • �25 Hall. Smoky Joe told me about Sheriff Brown taking his automobile away from hi m enee beeause the Sheriff had feund some whiskey in it that he (Smoky) was transporting to his road house . Now, Smoky is fighting to get his freedom his freedom to go home and dodge the Sheriff some more, and there is Starvin' Marvin who wants to go home to see his wife and two year old boy; a child that he has never seen~ and so it is with me - I want te go home - I just want to go home. *************** Less than twenty four hours after we landed here we found it - a path that wound its way through the jungle to a dance hall. Now I have danced in New York night clubs, patronized dine and dance places in Mexico, attended parties in exclusive social clubs in Havana, and participated in barn dances in the hills of North Carolina but never have I witnessed a set-up like this one. The dance hall was a native hut with a grass roof and a wood floor. The admission price two pesos. The band consisting of a saxophone, banjo and drum played familiar tunes like "Johnnie Get Your Gun" and "A1exander's Ragtime Band." Seated around the dance floor were several Filipino girls in their recently washed dresses. It was your privilege to dance with them but before doing so you had to remove your shoes and place them under the girl's chair. GI shoes are dangerous weapons, while jitter-bugging with these fair (slightly dark) bare-footed girls and it is while dancing in your socks that you get the true meaning of "socks appeal". ********** ***** I made Corporal but: 1. It was easier for me to date a New York chorus girl. 2. I expended less energy in climbing to the top of Ht. Mitchell. 3. I had fewer headaches going through the depression of 1933. 4. It was less trouble to figure out my 1942 income tax return. 5. course. 6. It took a smaller amount of skill to break a hundred on the golf It took less will power to stay sober on New Year's Eve . (I expect to make Sergeant during World War III.) ************** Since Finkelstein, Silverstein and Stein live in tent 99 anything is liable to happen. We play. We play gin rummy almost every night and I do not hesitate to take Stein and Silverstein on in any gambling activity that might be beneficial to my financial status. I am glad to take their pesos as both smoke my cigars without any offer of payment for same. Silverstein talked so much that the CO made him news commentator for our radio station. Stein's old man manufactures shirts in New York City and his son, a chip off of the old Stein, tries to take the shirt off the back of everybody he does any trading with. So with the oratorical ability of Silverstein, the progressive attitude of Stein and my Finkelstein knowledge of big business, we procured ten gallons of ice cream at a cost of 8 3/10 cents per gallon. It may interest you to know that the market price of ice cream on this island is $7 per gallon. �26 I will relate to you with brevity just how this trade was made. I received from Finkelstein's an item of merchandise retail value $9.75. Stein and Silverstein, under my supervision, traded this item for the ten gallons of ice cream . Off hand it would seem that the cost of the ice cream would be 97 ~ center per gallon but that is not true. I do not expect to pay Finkelstein ' s Inc. for this item of merchandise , and as a stockholder i n said corporation I have instructed them to c harge the accoun t off as a loss . They will not lose the $9.75 as the wholesale cost is less than this amount and furthermore they can deduct the loss from their income tax returns. After much scientific calculation I find that my stock in Finkelstein ' s Inc. has decreased in value 83 cents therefore the cost of the ice cream to me was 8 3/10 cents per gallon. ******* ******** Assorted Duties: chopping down trees digging a well hauling poles hauling fire wood hauling coal fighting forest fires sorting merchandise at warehouse sorting salvage merchandise smashing tin cans hauling water finance clerk detail clerk runner for headquarters stacking lumber pulling weeds and grass cleaning barracks watering trees loading and unloaaing trucks loading and unloading freight cars loading barracks bags on boats and trucks cleaning hatches on boats latrine orderly painting machinery communications clerk engineering cler k �27 Editor's Note: At the end of his tour of duty, Leo Finkelstein returned home to Asheville, North Carolina to resume management of Finkelstein's Pawn Shop. Leo recalls meeting Webb Ellis, another Asheville Lion's ~ub member, on the boat coming back to the United States from the Phillipines. The boat landed in Seattle, Washington the day the war was over with Japan, and they were discharged at Fort Bragg N.C. on September I, 1945. Ten days later Leo and Sylvia Bein were married by a judge in the Harlem section of New York City. In deference to hjs mother's wishes, they were again married agaifl by Rabbi Unger in Asheville. Leo and Sylvia, parents of Leo Finkelstein, Jr., a faculty member at Wright State Uruversity in Dayton, Ohio, reside at The Summit Retirement Community in Asheville, where Leo is pianist with "The Sanctimonieus Seven" and active member of the Asheville Lic:m's Club. �. _!.lJ u. .' - <Lc J _ z. I) Lt h ----~ J :> . ~ LETTERS FROM LEO WORLD WAR II CORRESPONDENCE TO THE ASHEVILLE LIONS CLUB LEO FINKELSTEIN �h A.J' kd.s~ @... I '-/ <-t 7 P~~!Ct D. ~llf/, £rtVIY ""-eo j~4J~! ~ftH~~ ~~ 1 1\..) (!_ ~ot 7Df- z~-z- ~ o 8 ;J �INTRODUCTION Leo Finkelstein was born in Asheville, North Carolina, in 1905, and in 1911 began his education at the Montford Avenue Grammar School. Leo graduated from Asheville High School in 1922, where he was business manager of the Hillbilly, the school monthly magazine, as well as pianist for a musical group. From playing saxophone with the AsheviJie Shrine Club Marching Band in the 1930s to piano with the Sanctimonious Seven for the Asheville Lion's Club in the 1990s, Leo has served his community though music, humor, business acumen, and community leadership. In 1922 Leo took over management of Finkelstein's Pawnshop, a downtown Ashevillt> institution which Leo's father Harry Finkelstein had opened in 1903 . Since his retirement from Finkelstein's in 1970, Leo has continued to be actively involved in the civic, fraternal, and religious life of the community. A member of the Asheville Lion' s Club for over sixty years, Leo has regaled his fellow Lions with his unique view oflife in Asheville and beyond. Inducted into the U.S. Army Air Corps in 1943, Leo was seen off at the bus by Lion C. Fred Brown, past president of the Asheville Lion's Club and former Vice Mayor of Asheville, who advised Leio to send letters back to the local Lion' s Club. Leo complied. What follows is his record of experiences and observations which were copied and sent back to the Asheville Lion's Club, to be read at meetings during World War II. Following induction at Camp Croft, South Carolina, Leo endured Basic Training at Miami Beach, Florida, before being sent to Tishomingo, Oklahoma for training as an Air Force Clerk. His collected stories were recorded in a diary, given to him by Miss Ruth Anderson, Leo's typing teacher at the Oklahoma College of Agriculture, where soldiers trained to be clerks in the Air Force. The majority of the following stories, vignettes, and poems originated in the Philippines, where Leo served until the final days of the war. �r ~ ~ 9-- "'-""-" '-- dl V b, (9 ft.t.\-0 ) le..o ~-t ~""' ~ • .:· c: • ·.. • .:. ,_:·.·!:'.. ;: . .: ... ~l.·.......... ........ ' """f1..-e. nt.l tc..eL '<>Je ll,~ ~ ~+ A-skv-, If"-- h., <r>0. "' (4.......1 ~'-'-'- . �%he n;a~ of --D&o lln%e2steln or1V@ ~esboxe ~beyj z ze, NoL tb caroli bll 4o ftr~ ~5fe..:.~ SERVICE RECORD Transf'ers Spar tanburg , sc Columbia, sc Miami Beach , FL Tishomingo , OK Kearns , Utah Pittsburg , CA Camp Croft Camp Jackson 414 Training Group Murray State College 501 Training Group Camp Ston eman San Francisco , CA New Caledonia New Caledonia Guadalcanal Los Negros 40th Ship Co . 6th Replacement Depot 6th Staging Area 394th Bomb Sq. (H) 394th Bomb Sq . (H) Wakde Noernfoor Morotai Samar Leyte Seattle, WA Fort Bragg , NC 394th Bomb Sq . 394th Bomb Sq . 394th Bomb Sq . 394th Bomb Sq . 93rd Repl . Fort Lawton ?------ --- Letter Sent Home From ~ami (H) (H) (H) (H) Induction Reception Basic Training A. A. F . T . T.C . (E &O) O.R. T . C. P . O. E . (Staging Area) P . O. E . South Pacific Novmea 5th Bomb GP (H) 13th Air Task Force F .E.A. F . F . E . A. F . F .E. A. F . F .E. A.F. P . O. E. P . O. D. Separation January 12, 1943 January 19, 1943 January 23 , 1943 March 29 , 1943 May 31 , 1943 Oct . Nov. Nov. Dec. Dec. 20 , 1943 1, 1943 23 , 1943 11, 194 3 19, 1943 Aug. 20 , 1944 Aug . 2: , 1944 Sept. 2b , 1944 Nov. 4 , 1944 March 2 , 1945 July 14 , 1945 Aug. 20 , 1945 Sept. 1, 1945 Beach I am still on the sun-kissed shores of Miami Beach and have been well educated in my advanced training . I have learned six new cuss words (especially) for top Master Sergeants , how to use an electric potato peeling machine, how to qo to Miami without a pass , how to stand at attention (while half asleep) , how to shine my shoes with the minimum amount of energy . I have been told that I will be shot if I go AW OL or fall asleep on guard duty and will get half- shot if I drink too much whiskey (like I didn ' t know). I have had so many instructions on making beds , cleaning out toilet bowls and other domestic duties that I think I would make a better wife than a soldier . I have been taught to jump off of nine foot fences on the obstacle course and if I refused to do it - I would be locked up here. If I did things like Lhat at home - I would be locked up there. I have been taught that if a pretty girl walks by - I can look, think and wish, but I ' m not allowed to talk or whistle at her. I have been taught to stand at attention and not move while a fly does calisthenics on my nose . This is the Army Air Force . From Tishomingo , Oklahoma Ti shomingo was an Tndian Chief who died here in the early part of the nineteenth century and this place has been dead ever since. This is the spot where the capitol of some Indian tribe was situated and today i t is a spot where 500 soldiers are s tudying to be technicians in the Air Corps and at the same time improving thejr technique with the co-eds on the campus of t h is college. *************** �5 My mail has been so light lately, all the way back to Asheville . I ' m getting to think my BOis reaching *************** Something happened to the wa ter works in Tishomingo and the Army Officers found that the water wasn ' t pure so none of t h e soldiers can go into town until the town government gets the wate r works fixed. I can ' t imagine soldiers going to town to drink water but I g u ess some of the officials are scared one of them will get drunk and take a bath in it. Before the war I thought being in the army would be a thrilling adventure - but now I know Sherman was right. I Before the war I thought the Air Corps was a mechanized force - but now wonder what the Hell I 'm marching for. Before the war, I thought floors were to walk on - but now I ' v e found they are to sweep a nd mop on. Before the war, I thought the Asheville-Citizen was a rotten n ewspaper but now I enjoy readi n g one four days old. Before the war , I would drink a cocktail before dinner - but now I drink milk with my dinner . Before the war, I would go to b ed sometimes at 4 AM - but now I get up at ll AM . Before the war, I was particular about wha t girl I took out - but now I ' m not so particular. Before the war, I struggled over a golf course - but now I s truggle over an obstacle course . Before the war, I used to shine at a dance - but now I shine my shoes. Before the war , I cussed at a golf ball - but now a sergeant cusses at me because I ' m not on the ball . Before the war, I d i dn ' t have much religion - but now T pray for a furlough. *************** In the army you are always in a hurry to get somewhere so you ' ll have more time to wait after you get there. *********'****** The obstacle course is so tough here that they take us on a nine mile hike to get limbered up so we can make i t . I reached the height of my social career in Tishomingo yesterday when my army typing teacher, Miss Anderson , invited me to have dinner wi th her at the Payne Hotel in the heart of Tishomingo . Miss Anderson is not only the best looking lady teacher on the campus, but a nice person to talk to and get all the information about the religious , social , fraternal , and political life in �6 this county. I arrived at the Payne Hotel exactly on time - for who am J to keep a lady waiting who invites me o ut to dinner and pays the check. My first v iew of the interior of the hotel was d epressing a nd to be conservative and brief with my description of this institution (founded in the s t age coach days) is that it was a pain. Nevertheless , my compan jon was n ice and t he kindly smiles of an understanding teacher to a lonesome soldier helped greatly to make my evening a success. We entered the dining room with a great deal of precision and grace , dodging some water that was leaking from the second floor through the ceiling and drippi n g on the dining room floor. Part of the p laster had already fallen from the ceiling and I felt surely t he balance would come down at any minute . The dining room was also being used for a linen s upply room and lumber storage room. Du ri ng our meal a lady would bring i n dirty line n, pile i t on t h e floor , a nd carry clean lin en out. I never could figure out wh y all the lumber was stacked in the corner and was afraid to ask . After dinner my teacher took me for a personally conducted tour through the darkened, dirty and low-ceilinged halls to room #35 (where she livesl and behold - there I visualized her pride and joy , a private bathroom - the o~ly one in ~ iotel. 1"'""' I" To be continued ... This place is thirty miles f rom a telegraph office and so far from civilization that one gets a wful lonesome at times . In fact one soldier got so lonesome that he got married on the telephone last night. This is a dry place, both in climate and drinking alcohol. It seems that Tishomingo is s o dry that even the bootleggers don't sell it. ••************* They believe in getting mar r ied youn g here and I haven ' t found a single girl over 22 years of age , so I haven ' t found a suitable lady my age to take out . W ould take some of the younger ones out but their papas keep shotgut:s and they know how to shoot straight out W est. Many times in my lifetime I have heard about people seeing snakes, especially at moments when more spirits were absorbed than the system could stand. This county here is very dry. In view of this fact I realized that I had not had a drink during the time I had been here - so it wasn ' t whiskey. Therefore it must be a live snake and there it was on the barrack ' s floor crawling and wiggling and sticking its tongue out at me. That is not the only type pet that is found in our barracks. Just last week we discovered a couple of live frogs and now and then a stray dog will walk in to look us over . At night we a re blessed with some miniature bombers to help put us to s l eep . These extra l a rge bugs are supposed to be June bugs but I know bugs cou l dn't grow tha t l arge in the one month of June. They gain a lot of �7 altitude and all of a sudden will dive at you and manage to find the one bare place that is out from under t h e cover . Otherwise t here is nothing much to bother you in Tishomingo. No pretty girls to get your mind off of your studies and you don ' t even have to be afraid of Indians because they are all tame . ************* * * From Kearns , Utah My frie nds never seemed so numerous - my bed never felt softer - my heart never beat faster - my Hudson never purred so smoothly - days never went by quicker - Mama's food never tasted so delicious - Patton Avenue never looked so glorified - the mountains were never more thrilling - the grass never looked greener - the girls never seemed prettier - the sun never shone brighter - and The Lions Club never looked better as i t did on my furlough home . Don ' t know what the city debt is now but take my word for it - Asheville is worth every damned penny of it. *************** Am here at an overseas replacement training center and considering the tough training I ' m getting now - it looks like the Army is going to make a commando out of me instead of an Air Force Clerk . ****** *** ***** * The Air Corps is just like our G.I. laundry: you get out of it just what you put into it , but you ' d never recognize it. *************** (Copied from another source) ~J~~ ~\. "After returning from my Homing uevice' (furlough), I went to Salt Lake City and done some Blind Flying (date with a girl one has never seen). W e we nt to the USO and had some Battery Acid (coffee). The Hash Burner (cook) didn ' t do so well that n ight so we didn ' t eat , instead we went out to look for some Serum (intoxicating beverage). After a few drinks I had to tell her to roll up her flaps (stop talking) . Then she left me and I had to go on ~ Patrol (search for more female companionship) . Believe me, I walked so much that night that I was ready for a Dog Show (foot inspection) ." *************** Yesterday I went on a ten mile hike in the blazing sun and a dust storm with GI shoes on my feet , leggings on my legs , a steel helmet on my head, a cartridge belt around my waist with a first aid kit and a canteen full of water beating against my side, a gas mask on one shoulder , an eight pound rifle on the other, a pack on my back with a tent, a tent pole, 5 tent stakes, a tent rope , a raincoat, a blanket , a knife, a fo rk, a spoon, a cup, other mess equipment , a suit of underwear, a pair of socks, a handkerchief, a towel , shaving cream, shaving brush, toothpaste , a comb , a razor, a mirror, soap, a bayonet i n my belt and two hand grenades in my packet . I spoke several cuss words out loud before I returned. I'll be court marshaled for that? *************** Do you think �8 Today we were given a demonstration of war gases. I was told to put on my gas mask and was placed in a c hamber filled with tear gas. Everything was lovely until I was instructed to take the mask off and breathe the stuff which I did very reluctantly. My eyes burnedt my nose burned, my throat burned and I cried and cried and cried so they let me out into the fresh air. After partially recovering, I was informed that I would be subjected to several other popular brands of gasses and all I had to do was sniff each one (like a hound dog sniffs at a rabbit track) and associate the smell with something I had smelled in civilian life . This was easy and my analysis was as follows: Chlora-Picknon gas smelled like corn whiskey. Phosgene gas smelled like scotch whiskey. Chlorine gas smelled like rye whiskey. MUstard gas smelled like bourbon whiskey. Hydrogen-mustard gas smelled like ordinary cooking whiskey. This camp is a cross section between a concentration camp and the Buncombe County chain gang. They keep you in this camp a couple of months before you are sent to a combat zone. They figure if you can live here two months without serious complications that you s hould be able to iive at any other point in the world for ten years. *************** It's so dirty here and I'm so used to it that if I ever get back home on a furl ough I'll have to sprinkle sand in the bed so I can sleep. *************** We are not troubled with rats here - they can't live in this climate . ••••••••••••••• I went to Bunny's Beer Garden last night and stayed to 5 AM and took Bunny home. Bunny's husband is in the Navy . I tried to be faithful to the Air Corps, but I couldn't find an aviator's wife who owned a beer garden . ................... Below is a schedule of how I spent a weekend here: Waiting in line to get a pass Waiting in line to get a bus to town Waiting in line to let an MP check your pass Waiting i n line to use phone to call girl Waiting to get taxi to go after girl Waiting in line to get permit to buy a pint of whiskey Waiting in line to buy whiskey Waiting in line to get seat in restaurant Waiting for waitress to bring ginger ale and ice Waiting in line for s treet car to take girl home Waiting for girl to make up her mind (to kiss me good-night) Walkinq to bus station Explaining to 1st sergeant why I was late getting back to camp Resting up from Saturday night ' s activities 30 min. 43 min. 9 min. 10 min. 52 min. 28 min. 27 min. 40 min . 12 min. 11 min. 02 min. 13 mi:n. 5 min. All day Sunday ••••••••••••••• The worst food in the Army Air Forc es is served in the mess halls of Kearns Field, Utah. A soldier here was getting somethinq to eat out of a �9 garbage can today and a Lieutenant nearby said, "Here you! Do you think vou are better than the rest of the men on th~s field - get on in the mess hall and eat!" ••••••••••••••• I've had details on this post from the telephone operator on the firing range to the office boy in the eommanding 0fficer's office) but my most interesting detail was handed to me today when I was made "Garbage Man" for the Mess Hall. Now don't think that a garbage man's job is just an ordinary bit of work. To the contrary, it takes a man who can stand gruesome odors and one who has specialized knowledge of slop and other varieties of waste. Neatly lined up outside of the kitchen of the Mess Hall are thirty-six GI garbage cans. My main duty was to see that the right stuff was put in the right can. There were certain cans designated for wet garbage, dry garbage, vegetable peelings ) fruit peelings, egg shells, coffee grounds, bones, ashes and trash . You must be careful not to put coffee grounds in the slop as it will kill the hogs. Tea leaves will make hogs very sick and if there is any broken glass in it - it won't do the hogs any good . I was quite proud of myself when the K,p , Sergeant complimented me on my work. The only thing that worried me was that I was doing all this for the benefit of hogs and pigs. Recently deodorized, Leo *************** I was told that every good soldier should know how to do his own laundry, so I decide that I'm going to do some washing for myself. I tried to find out the best method for washing clothes but it seemed liked very soldier had a different system. ALter much calculation and thought I start on what I think to be the correct procedure. The first thing I do is steal a bucket from the Mess Hall. Then I go to the PX and buy a box of Rinso and a bottle of Clorox. I put half the box o f Rinso and half the bottle of elorox i n the bucket filled with hot water and place my underwear and socks therein. The directions on the box said to soak for one hour but in order to do a good job I figured I would put the bucket of clothes under my bed for a day or two . Everything was coming along fine until the Lieutenant came through the barracks on an inspection tour and saw the bucket of clothes under my bed. I couldn't explain how the bucket got out of the Mess Hall or why I was doing my laundry during duty hours. The next thing I knew - I was restricted to the Post for a week. Nothing was going to stop me so I started to wash the clothes. I found that the dye had run out of the socks and had got in the underwear and I couldn't get the dye out of the underwear or back in the socks. Therefore, I went up to the Supply Sergeant and signed a statement of charges and got myself some new underwear and socks . Now I'm all washed up trying to wash my own washing . ••••••••••••••• l'roa ea~~~p Ston~, CA I can't tell you where I'm at because the censor wouldn't like it. I can't tell you what kind of clothes I've been issued because you would �10 kn~w where I was going. I can't tell you about the camp because its against the rules. I can't tell you about my equipment because it would jeopardize my security. I can tell you this th(!)ugh - I had a date with a girl by the na.me of Sylvia who used to live in Chicago, who is now living in Los Angeles and who is visiting some friends in a city near here and she is just as sweet as ever. '*************** The PK here reminds me of a t'!C!)Unt.r:y st(!)re with a night elub at.JIIC!)sphere. You can buy anything from beer to buttons with pretty little teen-age girls to serve you. At very reasonable prices you can have coffee, doughnuts, cakes, sandwiches, drinks or ice cream, a gift for mother, a souvenir for sister, a ean of shoe polish; a b~ttle ~f ink; a bath towel or your favorite pipe tobacco. A nickelodeon bellows forth music in one corner while a group of soldiers are singing favorite songs in another. A Lieutenant-Colonel walks in without a neck tie. A captain is talking to a private in a friendly manner. A sergeant is conversing with a s~l i ng WA~ . Here is the common meeting ground of our fighting men and women - a last gathering place on their native soil. Soon we will be bound for strange lands and new assignments . ••••••••••••••• l~ ~AaJ/~ rra. Boat on Paoif'ic ocean Here I am on a boat on the Pacific Ocean. While I don't have the accommodations of a Cook's tour, I can see the same scenery that many people pay thousands of dollars to see (ocean and sky). The sleeping quarters are a little crowded and the bunks are so close to each other that many times I wake up with another guy's foot in my face or his knee in my stomach. The latrine is also a little crowded. Traffic is so heavy inside (if you can get in) that it would make a New York traffic cop crazy trying to keep things straight. If you ever have to go, you got to go about an hour before you think you got to go so you will get there in time to go - then it takes about twenty minutes to get from where you go to the wash basin. Believe me, Firestone, if I could go out to your cabin for a month and have the privy at my disposal and that creek with fresh mountain water to do my laundry in - I'd be the happiest man in the world • ••••••••••••••• rroa Hew caledonia Here I am on an island in the South Paeifie with nothing t.o write about.. I can't write about the weather. I can't say whether it's hot or cold, rainy or dry . I can't tell the name of the island or the name of any towns near here or even if there are any towns on the island. I can't tell you if the country has mountains ~r plains or desert lands. I ean't even tell you the color of the soil. I can't tell you about the animal life, the birds, the fish or the insects. I can't tell you if the natives are white or black or yellow. I can't tell you what language they s peak or what country owns the island. I can't tell you if we are near a n ocean, a river or a lake. I ean•t tell you about the military personnel or equipment. I can't tell you about my duties. I can't tell you anything that would demoralize the civilians back home - so I ' ll close. �11 **************1r I want to tell you a story about a farmer ' s daughter on an island in the South Pacific. While out walking yesterday I stopped at the farmer ' s house and bought some cake a nd p)e from t h e farmer ' s daughter. T asked h er about some music and she brought out an antique model Victrola with some records . I thought I wo uld hear some music with a South Pacific rhythm but instead it was some good old North Carolina mountain music played by a hillbilly band . Something always happens to remind me of h ome - damn it. *'** *•**** .. *'***? From Guadacana.l Mosquitos are big here. One lit in the runway and they put seventy gallons of gas in i t before they found out it wasn't a P-38. ******* ******** Back home it was said that money isn't everything in life. Over here it might be said that money isn ' t anything in life. There is no place to spend it and nothing to buy. A free movie at night is the height of our entertainment . A bottle of beer once a week is the extent of our drinking . We look forward to mail call and chow. Mail from home is our greatest morale booster . on the walls of our living quarters are the pictures of a girl back home, a favorite movie star or maybe a scantly clad native girl . We see strange animals, lizards , and insects and often wonder why they like to crawl in bed with us. W search the region for souvenirs left by the Japs . We are e visited by natives who wear a towel where their pants ought to be. We work hard, eat plenty and sleep well. There is no complaining here - we are just one big happy family. We have moved into our new wigwam known as " The Southside Social and society Club, South Pacific Branch , Incorporated. " Believe me it is a masterful piece of architecture in solid mahogany . Our foundation is made of empty gasoline barrels. Our roof is made of empty bomb box tins. We got our lumber from an old torn down latrine. We did steal a few good coards after dark when nobody was looking. Our light sockets are home made out of airplane parts . We also have various pieces of antique furniture made out of shipping boxes picked up at the mess hall. We have a front porch. Our roof don ' t leak (very much) . The entire frame-work of our house is covered with mosquito netting and at a distance the shack appears to be a h uge bird cage with monkeys running around in it . Anyhow its home and it is good to know that we again have a place to call our own . *************** "Spot is a dog - a white dog with one black spot over his right eye . Spot is the mascot of a certain crew who maintained a certain airplane at a certain field in the South Pacific. Spot knew ' his' airplane - the airplane his crew worked on . Spot would ride out on the bus to the field every mo rni ng and would j~p off at the bunker on which his airplane wa s parked. He knew the location of his plane just like a civilian dog would know the location of its home . He stayed by his airplane in all kinds of weath ~r a nd admired the splendid way his crew kept the ship in shape . Not long ago the airplane didn't return from a flight therefore the crew didn't go out to the field . Spot would ride out to the field on the bus as usual every morning and would j ump off at the bunker that had held his plane . For many days that followed I could see Spot standing there, alone, on the empty bunker , waiting for his airplane to come home. ********* ****** �12 I discovered a new animal today. It was a lizard, four feet long, running around in my front yard . The reptile looked like an alligator but it didn ' t have the same disposition. Tt was supposed to be harmless but he didn't look very sociable to me . His skin looked like it would make a good traveling bag but since I wasn ' t going anywhere , I didn ' t try to capture t he thing. He finally ran down i n my fox hole and I a m hoping , in the event I have to use that fox hole some night, that he won ' t be there with d wife and family . Anyhow, I am looking forward to the time when I can get home , where there is nothing to bother me but house flies, bumble bees and ants. **********"***** This is a dehydrated war . Our brea k fast is made ~ t. the mess hall with a powder they mix with water. Out of this mixture comes hot cakes , pan cakes , flat - jacks and wheat cakes and they all taste alike . One gallon of dehydrated potato powder is mixed with water and out comes five gallons of mashed potatoes without mashing them . Th e deh ydrated eggs at the mess hall have a sign on them reading " eggs " because they don ' t look like eggs or taste like eggs. The dehydrated milk turns out to be dark grey a nd putting it in the dehydrated coffee keeps you from getti n g an infection from the stuff. The dehydrated lemonade could be used for b attery acid but we use it mostly for washing our mess kits . If somebody woul d only i n ven t dehydrated whis ke y - that wo u ld be a g reat a contribution to the war effort . Our mail is even dehydrated into v-mail . Yes, everything is dehydrated a r ound here except the weather. *****•*** ... **** I am now a politician. of his tribe . This i~ I was the cau se of a na t i ve being made " chief " how it happened . A certain native J called " Joe'' would come ove r to my shack to visit me and even though he talked very little English , I found out from him much about his life and the customs of his people . These poor devils wor k for ten cents a day. They sign u p for a yea r and are paid in full at the end of their contract . Joe always admired a large knife that I had. This knife was sent to me from home , being one that I had in my collection , hanging on the wall of my bar room. Every time I showed it to Joe a big smile would come over his face, his snow white teeth would shine like pearls, his eyes gleamed with fire and he would say ove r and over , " Nice , T like . Nice, I like! " He would carefully caress the etched figure of a lion on the blade and would gaze for minutes at his image on the shiny steel . One day Joe came ove r to see me . He had five American dollar bills wrapped in an old cloth bag. He offered me the five dollars a nd his war club for my knife. I traded with him and he left my shack the happiest man I ' ve ever looked upon. I followed him over to the native village and there the whole tribe gathered around and made him chief because of his ability to acquire such a wonderful knife. Never would J have thought, when T nailed t hat knife to the wall of my bar at home , that someday it would be the cause of a man bei ng made chief of a native tribe on an island in the south Pacific. **********'***** There are no sheets, no mattresses, no pillows, no sprin gs on my cot but when I lay down to go to s leep I acquire a feeling of comfort and contentment. Sometimes I gaze at the stars shining in the tropical heavens . Other times I l is t e n to the rain beating down on the tin roof. There are no pains , no nerves, no responsibilities, no vain regrets , no anticipation of gatherin g difficulties , no financial problems to disturb my hard earned slumber . I wake up i n the morning and look at the mountains around me . Their lofty peaks �13 remind me of the mountains at home. This is a wonderful place to lead a n easy life but frankly I would not hesitate to accept any opportunity to go back to my civilian life once again. Parts of this area are cove r ed with j ungle vegetation . Enormous tree trunks covered with snake like vines , stra nge flowers and inhabited by screeching parrots tower above the semisolid mass of bamboo , palms, ferns , writhing roots , cree ping lizards and thousands of e n ergetic grasshoppers . There are hellgrammites and spiders to be had o n the island but personally I could do well withou t them, especially after seeing the effects of their bites. Letters, letters , letters- that ' s the only way I have to keep i n t ouc h with t h e old country (the United States) and what a problem ! Letters to my mother must be dignified and cheerful . Letters to my fraternal brothers , the police department and some of the girls I used to go with don ' t have to be so dignified. Letters to the bion s Club must be interesting and to the point. Letters to my attorney, accountant, and manager should express my appreciation for their faithful services even though I ' m wondering if they are on the job . In my letters to my Rabbi , I try to be religious . In my letters to my social club, T try to be a beer drinker and a n e xpert card player . betters to my best girl must be affectionate even though I think she is going out with a couple of sergeants. In my letters to my banker I am optimistic , cautious a nd hopeful. In all my letters I can ' t say anything that would demoralile the people at home because I know they are h aving a tough time with ration poi n ts, whiskey shortages , War Bond Drives and taxes . Finally, I have to please the censor but he has an advantage over you - he can cut out what he don ' t like . Poxes don ' t live in a fox hole . Tt ' s a place we run i n, crawl in , fall in , slide in , scramble in or jump in in event of an air raid . M ack and I got orders to fill in an old one by our shack . Mack is lazy as Hell and since I was getting up in years we decided to get a couple of natives to do the job . Mack went over to the native village and negotiated for the job, using two bucks of mine for payment , which I furnished very reluctantly . When the natives started to fill the hole with dirt , a snake , five feet long , ran out . ack , being a country boy, picked up the snake by its tail and Powers (a M butcher in civilian life) , c hopped his h ead off w1th a n axe before T stopped running. The next thing to come out was a ground rat . One of the natives caught him with his bare hands and killed it before I could stop running. The next things to come out were four centipedes about a foot long apiece. One bite from one of these huge worms and you ~un for t h e dispensary as fast as you can , c ussing your draft board all along the way with words unfit to write. The fox hole is now filled up so guess I ' l l take a nap because I'm tired out from running . From Los Negros-Admiralty Islands Prior to my induction in the army I considered myself a respectable upright citizen of Buncombe County , North Carolina. I was always honest except for a few times during my childhood days when I swiped onions from Mrs . Roberts ' garden , stole an apple from Mr. Book ' s grocery store and helped myself to all the cherries I could eat from a neighbor's cherry tree . My childhood habits started again the other day when I volunteered (by �14 request) to help unload several barges of beer . Even though our secret weapons are not guarded, each barge of beer has armed guards . I found that if I accidentally dropped a case of beer that sometimes several bottles would fall out a~d in gathering up these bottles sometimes they accidentally got inside my shirt and as long as they were inside my shirt, I didn ' t see any reason not to drink them. Do you think I'll go to Hell for this? *************** On this beautiful (to some people) island in the Admiralty Group one can sit under a swaying palm tree (until a coconut falls and bounces off your head) and admire the sun-kissed shores (through sun glasses to keep from going blind). You may breathe deeply of the fresh air (saturated with the smell of stagnant salt water) and gaze at the moon (providing you can see through your mosquito net). In the daytime you can enjoy the cool refreshing rains (if you don't mind getting as wet as a drowned rat). In the evenings it's your privilege to see a new movie featuring William s. Hart or Fatty Arbuckle and go back to your tent knowing you will have a good night ' s sleep (providin g you take sleeping pills). It is thrilling to search the jungle for souvenirs (if you don ' t mind picking up booby traps). If you get the tooth ache you can go to the dentist. If you don't feel like working you can go on sick call. If you get homesick you can go see the chaplain. This is an ideal place to be . ******* ... '**'~~~'***'* Every morning at breakfast time I am greeted by " Porkie ." He is a little pig and a cute little pig at that. He could be part dog because he looks up at me and wags his tail . He could be part wild boar because he pushes me around with his nose . Anyhow in this Godforsaken country I welcome most any kind of a friend and believe me Porkie is my friend because he will let me pet him and feed him. Nobody knows where Porkie came from. Maybe the Japs left him here or maybe he wandered down into the camp from the hills . There have been some suggestions about killing Porkie and roasting him ove r a fire but I don ' t think there is any danger of that happening because we can ' t eat Pork]e and have him too . Sometime ago while I was on a troop transport a warning came over the loud speaker than a Jap battleship and two destroyers had been sighted. I was playing checkers , some other guys were playing cards , some reading. You could hear a number of wise cracks abo u t the situation but nobody seemed to be disturbed. We were all in the same boat and it appeared that regardless of our religious beliefs, political opinions, social or financial standings in civil ian 1 if~, that being in the same boat under these conditions united us in the closest bonds of fellowship. True this war has made soldiers of us but in doing so it has not destroyed that individuality, humor and tolerance we possessed. In my opinion it has cemented firmer in us these necessities of a peaceful democratic society. *************•* (Adapted from an instruction booklet) Suppose you got lost in the jungle. You would have nothing to worry about as far as food is concerned . You may eat, with safety, anything that the monkeys eat and you can even eat the monkeys. They are considered a delicacy by the natives. More than likely you would start your day off with a breakfast of �15 grasshoppers . The legs and wings pulled off , toasted on the end of a stick or fried in coconut oil , they are not at all displeasing to the taste . Of course if you don ' t like grasshoppers you could eat winged ants , or termites particularly the quee n s and t he eggs of ants. For dinner I would suggest roasted rat smothered with lizard tails . Rats are plentiful and have a taste simi l ar to large fruit bats. Lizards are also plentiful and the meat from the hindquarters is preferred . A nice seaweed salad would be appropriate . Strangely enough seaweeds are not very salty and their water content is fairly fresh . In general , the pink, purple and the reddish or green seaweeds are best . For dessert I would recommend water lilies with chopped white grub worms . Supper should be your biggest meal . You eould start out with snake meat sliced like bologna, wild sweet potato chips and fern tips. All snakes are good to eat - even the poisonous ones , if the head is cut off immediately after capture. Your soup could be turtle soup seasoned with bamboo shoots and the buds of palm trees . A salad of bananas and figs would go good if you could find some . Your main course may be porcupine stew or broiled kangaroo steaks with hard boiled bird eggs on the side . Seriously spea king all the items I have mentioned in this letter are edible and you don't need any ration points to get t h em. *** .. **'********* Was just thinking what it would be like to have an Asheville Social Club here. ~o begin with you wouldn't have a modern buildin g like the one at home. It would be a frame buildjng covered with netting or straw. The structu re wouldn ' t need a heating plant because we have an abundance of that here. You wouldn't be able to sell beer. The members would have to drink chlorinated river water and like it. The poker players wouldn't be able to concentrate on their hands as the roar of airplanes overhead would disturb them. You wouldn ' t be able to call a taxi to go home . You would have to walk - maybe in some pretty deep mud . You couldn' t hold a dance as there are no women to dance with . The rummy players would h a ve to be satisfied with old dilapidated cards as new ones are rare. The trustees would h a v e no worries since there is no place to spend any money. There would be one advantage of having the Club here - you guys wouldn ' t have your wives calling you up at 1 AM to come home. **** •* ********* I got caught with my pants down. I went into the latrine this morning to enjoy a good smoke and to read the funnies . Gracefully, I made myself as comfo.r table as possible on the GI equipmen t therein, relaxing and watching the flies, red ants , and lizards playing football, follow-the-leader, and other games on the rafters and walls. Suddenly, I noticed a spider sitting right beside me - not an ordinary one with wire size legs , but one whose size reminded me of the lobsters I used to eat at home, and whose legs reminded me of those of Gloria Swanson. The gruesome and monstrous creature crawled slowly toward me and I had no trouble doing my duty - it scared i t out of me . In order that you might become acquainted with my daily routine here, I am listing activit~es below : 6 AM Wake up . Complain about the heat . Shake my shoes to see if any centipedes are parked inside . Put on my clothes. 6 : 04 AM Think about washing my hands but decide it is too much trouble so I start for chow. 6 :06 AM Look for Porkie (the pet pig) but he don't seem to be around �16 yet. Guess he is still asleep - the lucky hog. 6:15AM After a short argument I get the cook to turn my egg over because I don't like i t half done. 6:35 AM wash my mess ki t and complain about the heat. I 6:40 AM Go back to my tent. decide to postpone the job. Looks like it needs cleaning up but 6:41 AM Lay down on my cot and read a few pages of a wild west story. 7:10AM Complain about the heat. 7:30 AM Climb on a GI truck and ride out to my office at the field . The truck jars so much i t almost shakes my kidneys loose. 7:45 AM Arrive at my office (a tent) and dust off the furniture. I don't have to sweep the f l oor because it is a d~rt f l oor and i t don't do no good to sweep the dirt off of dirt. 8:00 AM Sgt. Lueck comes in singing. Can't imagine why he is singing so early in the morning. I soon find out the reason - he made Staff sergeant on a new rating l i st , 8:05 AM Sgt. Lueck says that I didn't make Corporal on the new list because the squadron is lousy with corporals and some of them will have to die, transfer, go horne or get promoted before I could get another stripe. 8:20 AM Capt. Gardner comes in and offers S/Sgt , bueck congratul ations and me his sympathy. He tells me that he did his best to get me a rating and he thinks he will be able to push me up next time. 9:00 AM Pfc. Runnels comes in and wants to know if I made corporal. When he found out I didn't he suggested I enter a complaint . I explained that I wasn't making the army my career and it didn't make much difference one way or another. 10:00 AM I 11 : 00 AM beave the f i e l d for the camp area in the same kidney- shaking 11:15 AM Arrive at the camp area . do the same thing I did at 7:10AM. truck. 11:20 AM Stop at the PX and since they were sold out of candy, cookies and food; I didn't buy anything . 11:31 AM Thought that I would wash up but I go to chow instead. 11:59 AM Lay down on my cot for my noon time nap. heat and fall asleep. Complain about the 1:30 PM Wake up and jump on the truck goi ng back to the field , 1:45 PM Arrive at the office and i t is so hot I take my shirt off. 1:47 PM The flies, using my back for a landing field, worry me so much that I put my shirt back on. 2:10 PM Some pilot does a buzz job with his plane over my tent and I go out to see if the tops of the coconut trees are still there. �17 3:00 PM I do the same thing I did at 10 AM only twice as much! 4:00 PM My day's work done. T hop on the truck for the camp area. Caught one of the new easy riding trucks with eight wheels and no spring. 4 : 20 PM Went by the mail room for my mail which didn ' t arrive. 4:30 PM Against my better judgement I took a shower. 5 : 00 PM Chow. ~ : 4~ PM Write letters . 7:00 PM Moving picture starts. previous occasions , I go see it again. Since I ' ve seen it on only three 10 : 00 PM Lights out. Discussion of various tepics goes o n between t he members of the tent. The subjects under discussion wi ll be omi t ted for the benefit of any person under eight years of age who might read this. Tn this area we have the Army Air Forces and the United States Navy . 1 am in the Army Air Forces and my old friend , Harry Murdock, former assistant circulation manager of the Asheville Times , is in the Navy. Now, we see each other often, and in order to show how mu~h the Navy will cooperate with the Army, Harry agreed to procure fo r me an item that the Navy has and the Army has not. (The method of obtaining this item will not be revealed at this time.) I had not looked upon one of these luxuries for nine months and when he brought it to me , it was too delightful to describe - too wonderful to believe. It wa s more welcome than an umbrella in the rain, an ice cold drink on a hot day or a fur coat by a chorus girl. There was never such beauty in the mountains of western North Carolina at autumn time - no such glamour in a sunset on the ocean or a bathing beauty content . It was more invigorating than a scotch a nd soda or a banana split. Never before had I bestowed upon me such a gift and now when I go to sleep on that second hand " Navy issue'' mattress , I'll dream of days to come when I can be home again. Dear Mom: When I try to eat this GI food, I think of how I ate at home - it's then I think of you dear mom. When I look at my floor of dirt, I think of how the floors at home were so shiny and clean - it ' s then I think of you dear Mom. When I try to go to bed at night, I think of the soft bed I had at home with clean sheets and clean pillow cases - it ' s then I think of you dear Mom. When I have the toothache and nobody here seem to care - it's then I think of you dear Mom. When buttons come off I try to sew them on - it ' s then I think of you dear Mom. You were my cook, my nurse, my advisor , and my teacher and now when I need one of these - it's then I think of you dear M . om ~-*~** ********* �18 If you should become ill all you would have to do is call the doctor and he usually fixes you up . A sick airplane is a different story . To begin with there is a crew who makes general repairs on the ship. Besides this crew there are propeller specialists, engine specialists, hydraulic specialists, bomb-sight specialists• men who specialize in changing engines; ~adio men who repair the radios, a tire change department, a section that looks after parachutes, life rafts, emergency rations, oxygen bottles and fire extinguishers, a supply department for parts needed, a refuel unit to service the ships with gas and oil• i nstrument specialists, welders, sheet metal men; electrical experts, painters, ordnance men to load bombs, a~ent men to look after the guns, carburetor specialists, guards to guard the planes, a clerical staff to keep the records, inspectors, crew chiefs to supervise the crews, flight chiefs to supervise the crew chiefs and line chiefs to supervise the flight chiefs. Aren't you happy that you do not require as much attention as an airplane to keep you in shape? ................ over here, far away from horne, I think a lot and what do you think I think about? First of all, I think a good deal about my family, my loved ones and my friends I left behind. I also think about Sunset MOuntai n, Pack square, Vance Monument, Morn's cooking, the shiny floors in my house - the green grass in the yard. Happenings that didn't seem important at the time now seem to be great events . I think of the time when I was in the second grade of grammar school and stole an apple from Mr. Book's Grocery Store on ~herry street. I remember the first licking my daddy gave me for throwing a rock at my sister - he shook me so hard that the cuff links fell out of my shirt sleeves and I never could find them. I think about the first time I went fishing and caught a fish. I remember the time I went hunting, killed a deer, and was sor~y that I did it. I think about my golf games at Beaver Lake. I can recall the time I almost had a fight with or. Robinson at a Temple Club meeting. I think of the time I beat John vance in an election for trustee of the Elks Lodge. My fondest memories are of the children around town who called me "Uncle Leo." I think about the Christmas day when I played Santa Claus with the rne.m bers of the Lions Club at the Salvation Army Chapel. I think of the night that I, a bachelor, presided at a Father and Son Banquet at Congregation Beth-HaTephila. I think very little of the materialistic things I left behind. I realize now that the important things in my lifetime - the things that mean the most to me now were just little things, just everyday happenings. Corporal Mark is a great guy and that is why I like to do a favor for him if I can. Well, I am the guy who makes up the detail list and Corporal Mark requested that I put him on the roving guard detail. Now, a roving guard has a comparatively easy job. He gets a jeep, rides around all night and sees that no one steals one of our heavy bombers (weight 60,000 pounds). Corporal Mark is very efficient in his guarding because he goes beyond the usual call of duty and guards, not only the bombers, but the mess hall and other places where food and supplies are stored. ~orporal Mark i s very successful in obtaining various types of edibles while on guard duty and during the early morning hours he and I devour this food with a great deal of pleasure and �19 satisfaction to our a : ways hungry stomachs. Now Corporal Mark is an upright. l and honest fellow and I think he was getting the idea that we weren't justl y entitled to the extra stuff to eat . That idea soon vanished because I told him about the amount of taxes the government was hitting me for while I was over here fighting for world peace so we decided ~hat we could go on procurin g this nourishment without hesitation and with a clean conscience. *************** From Wakde , New Guinea l WfiDDil Go Home Here I am an enlisted ma n , Getting along the best I can , The officers have steak while I eat Spam, I wanna go home. Women I crave there is no doubt , Can ' t have nurses here about , Because the officers take them out , I wanna go home . en like me will get the blues , M No whiskey for us and that ain ' t news , Because the officers get all the booze , I wanna go home . can't can ' t But the I wanna I I get a furlough regulations say, rest and I can ' t play, officers manage to find a way, go home . ********"'**"**'*1r The Engineering Office sent Sergeant Reville and me over to the other side of the field to get a new bomber for our squadron . I sure felt important when the fellow over there asked me to sign a receipt for the ship. Can you imagine Pfc . Finkelstein signing for $250,000 worth of airplane? I assure you i t was less trouble for me to get that airplane than i t would be for you to kiss a bride at a wedding . I climbed up in the pilot ' s cockpit while sergeant Reville hooked his eletrac to the nose wheel of the plane . Now Sergeant Reville can pull these 60,000 pound monsters around the field with his eletrac just like a taby pulls a wagon around the living room and knocks over all the furniture only Sergeant Reville never knocks anything over. He pulled me and the airplane down the taxi strip to our area where I stopped the gasoline truck and said, " Hey Corporal , fill her up. I think she will take about 3000 gallons ." As he was filling it up I recalled the time when I was home on my furlough and needed a little extra gasoline to drive my girl up to my favorite parking place on Beaucatcher Mountain and return home (at a decent hour - of course) . W ell , I went to the rationing board and they would only give me five gallons - the stingy devils. W ish they could see me now getting 3100 gallons. The only trouble over here is that I got no automobile and no girl to drive up a mountain. *************** Thousands of Jnps had landed, Near the land of the rising su~ , On an island in the Pacific, �20 They had nowhere else to run . Now on this tiny island , A good size town was found , The Japs - they took it over , And wandered all around. Our bombers got their orders, And took off on the mission, To save the town if possible , And bomb the Jap position. One bombardier was fearless, And always on the ball , This flight he made a grave mistake, With no excuse at all . He aimed right at the target , He carefully fixed his sight, He missed the Jap position , Hit a house with a big red light. Now when we take t hat island, And give the Japs a trimmin ' , We ' ll still be cussin' the bombardier, Who blew up all the women. It all started when I received one of Finkelstein's $7 . 95 rebuilt watc h es . A guy offered me an old radio and twenty-five dollars in cash for it and I traded. Money is almost useless over here but I managed to give the twenty-five dollars to another guy who gave me a half gallon of home-made drinking beverage which I think was made out of fermented canned corn and 100 octane gasoline. I pooled my half-gallon of imitation "Carolina corn " with a fellow who had a case of beer and we proceeded to drink it all up vut he passed out before we finis h ed and I had ten cans of beer left on my hands as my share of the party. I traded the beer for a pipe , ten packages of tobacco , a pocket knife and a fountain pen. I traded the knife for a flashlight and three cans of beans. I ate the three cans of beans and traded the fountain pen for an electric light socket, a cigarette lighter and two dollars. I invested the two dollars in a crap game, won eight dollars, took the proceeds and bought a radio tube to fix my radio. I traded the radio for a boat which later sank. I traded three packages of tobacco for four cigars and three air mail stamps . I smoked the cigars and used t he three air ma il stamps to write to three friends back in the States requesting from each a box of food. Now, when and if I receive these boxes of food , I will be able to render to you a complete financial statement as to how I came out on the watch. Here in the jungle we don ' t have houses for house flies to live in but we do have house flies. These flies look like the flies at home who have survived the fly swatter , but they don't lead the same kind of life . They follow us wherever we go but they don't follow us to the mess hall because they don ' t like the GI food the mess sergeant slings at us no more than we do . Once in awhile , if a fly gets about half starved , he will fly around the mess hall looking for something to eat. They are persistent devils and they won ' t be shoo'd away like the American flies. During dinner one made eighteen dives at my mess kit before I got him. Many of these brave flies, who dare eat our �21 food , j ust turn over on their backs after the first bite , kick their legs up i n the air and die. It ' s a r o ugh war - even for flies . ************** * The war seems to be getting l onger every day . * ******* ** ***** From Noemfoor Starvin ' Marvin ' s real name is Sgt . Marvin Binion but we call h im Starvin ' Marvin b e cause h e n ever gets enough to eat . In fact none of us get enough to eat - only he complains about it more than we do . Now Starvin ' M arvin h as given e ve rybody in our tent a name . Luke the Droop is really Sgt. Lueck , chief e ngineering clerk. Ed the Red is a crew chief on a n airplane . Herman the German is chief clerk in Tech Supply and Leo the Hero is nobody else but me , an ordinary clerk who is fed up with the setup . Luke the Droop has been overseas thirty months and expects to go back to the States on the " Rotation Plan '' only it hasn ' t rotated far enough to reach him yet . on this account he is very cautious during air raids b ecause he figures he is going home soon and he wa nts to get there in good shape . One night Hoim the Woim (which is a s h ort name for Herman t h e German ) woke us up yelling "Air Raid. " Luke the Droop was dressed and in a fox hole before any of us got out of bed. By the time I put on my shoes and grabbed my clothes everybody was gone including Ed the Red who moves very slowly especially whe n i t comes to doing any work on his airplane . I wa ndered out of the tent , t he moon was shining brightly a nd everything seemed p eaceful to me . It wasn ' t peaceful long and I beat five guy s to a jeep and crawled under it. It was my first air raid experience and now I imagine I ' ll be know as " Foxhole Finkelstein " instead of Leo the Her o . ************k** Written from MOrotai My Helmet M helmet is a useful thing , y To wear upon my head, It ' s made of good materials , And feels almost like lead . My helmet makes a wash bowl , I can use it any place, I fill it up with water, And wash my hands and face . M fox hole roof is awful low, y I can ' t stdnd up in there, So I put my helmet on the floor , And use it for a chair. Now if I want a basket , To hang down from my bunk , It sure does make a lovely thing, To hold all kinds of junk . �22 Now if I ' m sentimental , For flowers and that r ot , I fill it up with good old djrt, And I got a flower pot. Now if I want to take a n ap, Beneath a weeping willow, I place it down upon the ground, And use it for a pillow . Now when I ligh t a candle , And n eed a candlestick, I turn t he h e lmet upside down, It al wa ys does t he tric k. Now whe n my socks get dirty, And the odor isn ' t right , T fill the t hing with soapy water, And let them soa k all night. No w hard boiled eggs are somethi ng, I always d i d admire , So I fill the helmet full of water , And put them on the fire . Now when we had a dim out , There ' s no use to be afraid , T put t h e helmet o n t he light, And u se it fo r a shade . Now when this war is ove r, (I ' ve often heard it said) , The h e lmel ' ll be a useful thing, To keep beneath the bed. finis *********""'***** Little W acs Real c ute They wa n t Parachute. In chute Silk cloth Real clean Very soft . Love pilots W ith skill Get chutes At will . Take back To shanties Make many Pair panties . �23 Interesting Facts about Life on the South Pacific Islands with the Air Forces: A whiskey still can be made out of hydraulic tubing, an oxygen tank and other airplane parts. Corn whiskey can be made out of fermented canned corn. American whiskey may be bought from $35 to $60 per quart. A motor boat can be constructed from two airplane belly tanks a nd a small power unit . The silk cloth in p arachutes may be used to make panties for nurses and Wacs . All natives are frie ndly - there are no cannibals. I n trad i ng wi t h t h e nati ves yo u ca n get more with a Bible or a piece of cloth than you can get with money or jewel ry. 100 octane gasoline may b e used for ciga r ette lighter fluid. Gasoline is easier to procure than water . Sometimes it requires written permission to get five gallons of wa ter for laundry purposes. Gasoline is available i n any quantity for any purpose . There are more s na kes per s quare rn.i le in the mountains of North Ca rolina t han i n the jungl e . Tt is safer in a fox h ole during a n air r aid than riding in an automobile back home with your wife driving it . All natives are friendl y in these parts . There a re no cannibals . That's more t h a n T ca n say for the tax col lector back home . Taking a bath out of a helmet is more complicated than you thi nk. Nevertheless, the job can be done without exerting too much effort if the following directions a r e complied wi th: Never try to sit in the helmet. Place it on a corn er pole of a tent and stand beside it . Buckle the chin strap and let it hang down like a flower basket . Fill the helmet full of water . Get the water i n a legitimate manner if you can , othe rwise stea l it from the mess hall or the officer ' s showers there is always ple nty there . Place a copy of your home town n ewspaper on the ground (the Sunday edition is best because it has more pages and makes a softer bath mat) . Take a cake of soap a nd using the water in the helmet lather up f r om feet to h ead or h ead to feet - it do n ' t make n o difference . Before the soap dries , fill the helmet with fresh water and p o ur ove r top of head . This is repeated until all the soap is washed off . If the water is too cold , there is nothing you can do about it . Dry with a towe l either clean or dirty. Shake all ants and bugs out of towel before usi ng . I n t h e event of an air raid during the process of taking the ba t h , go to you r fox hole at once . After the "all clear" start all over from the beginning. * * ******* **** ** A jungle snake, On Guadalcanal, �24 W ent crawling over, To see his gal. He found his gal, Did not feel fit , She had a cold, That wouldn ' t quit. And every time , That she would cough, The jungle snake , Would get hissed off. Master Sergeant Johnson and I started the evening off by opening a can of salmon and e nded up by opening a gold mine or at least we pla nned to open one after the war. Sergeant Johnson , after looking at the label on the above mentioned salmon can , told me that he was once foreman of the cannery in Alaska that canned this particular can of salmon. He insisted on telling me about the different species of salmon, the white salmon, the pink salmon and ! forgot the other colors he mentioned. Anyway I wasn ' t interested in the colors of salmon in Alaska because I was hungry and the only salmon I was interested in at that particular time was the salmon in the can. In order to be sure we wou ldn ' t get poison ed by the salmon , we took several shots of Jungle Juice before and after eating the fish. For your information Jungle Juice is made of 190 proof medical alcohol , colored and flavored with burnt sugar and diluted with a small quantity of water. Jungle Juice seems to build up conversation and t h e conversation drifted all around Alaska . W fi nally got on the subject of gold and gold mines . e According to what Sgt. John son said , he h ad done a goodly amount of gold hunting in Alaska and was well versed in mineralogy. W figured we could buy e a seaplane after the war from the Navy at a fraction of the original cost , fly to Alaska , land on the many inaccessible lakes , pan th~ir shores for gold and get rich quick (if the income tax man don ' t find us). I have written all my friends back home offering to sell t h em stock in t h e Finkelstein-Johnson F.xpedition to Alaska. Smoky Joe ' s home is just a little bit south of Asheville , North Carolina. He is one of the cooks down at our Mess Hall , a good guy, and a GI who can sympathize with all the other GTs who have to eat the food he prepares . Before the war Smoky Joe owned a road house on the highway going south from Asheville , and, after talking with him I found that I had patronized his institution on numerous occasions during my youn ger yea r s . Sin ce we were practically neighbors in civilian life , we felt that we should continue over here as good ~eighbors and so we are. There is no better friend in the Army than a cook because when you get hungry - he is the only man who can hel p you out . Tn passing , r might mention that Smoky Joe, Starvin' Marvin and I have on numerous instances enjoyed eatin g s urplus stocks of food from the M ess Hall . Smoky Joe told me about Sheriff Brown taking his automobile away f rom him once because the She riff had found some whiskey in it t h at he (Smoky) was �25 transporting to his road house. Now, Smoky is fighting to get his freedom his freedom to go home and dodge the Sheriff some more, and there is Starvin' Marvin whe wan~s te go heme ~o see his wife and two year old boy; a ehiid that he has never seen, and so it is with me - I want to go home - I just want to go home . ................ rraa s-r; Phi.l.ipp:lna za. Less than twenty four hours after we landed here we found it - a path that wound its way through the jungle to a dance hall. Now I have danced in New York night clubs, patronized dine and dance places in Mexico, attended parties in exclusive social clubs in Havana, and participated in barn dances in the hills of North Carolina but never have I witnessed a set-up like this one. The dance hall was a native hut with a grass roof and a wood floor. The admission price two pesos. The band consisting of a saxophone, banjo and drum played familiar tunes like "Johnnie Get Your Gun" and "Alexander's Ragtime Band." Seated around the dance floor were several Filipino girls in their recently washed dresses. It was your privilege to dance with them but before doing so you had to remove your shoes and place them under the girl's chair. GI shoes are dangerous weapons, while jitter-bugging with these fair (slightly dark) bare-footed girls and it is while dancing in your socks that you get the true meaning of "socks appeal". *************** I made corporal but: 1. It was easier for me to date a New York chorus girl. 2. I expended less energy in climbing to the top of Mt. Mitchell. 3. I had fewer headaches going through the depression of 1933. 4. It was less trouble to figure out my 1942 income tax return. 5. course. 6. It took a smaller amount of skill to break a hundred on the golf It took less will power to stay sober on New Year's Eve. (I expect to make Sergeant during World War III.) ************** Since Finkelstein, Silverstein and Stein live in tent 99 anything is li.a ble to happen. We play. We play gin rummy almost every night and I do not hesitate to take Stein and Silverstein on in any gambling activity that might be beneficial to my financial status. I am glad to take their pesos as both smoke my cigars without any offer of payment for same. Silverstein talked so much that the CO made him news commentator for our radio station. Stein's old man manufactures shirts in New York City and his son, a chip off of the old Stein, tries to take the shirt off the back of everybody he does any trading with. So with the oratorical ability of Silverstein, the progressive attitude of Stein and my Finkelstein knowledge of big business, we procured ten gallons of ice cream at a cost of 8 3/10 cents per gallon. It may interest you to know that the market price of ice cream on this island is $7 per g.allon. I will relate to you with brevity just how this trade was made. I received from Finkelstein's an item of merchandise retail value $9.75. Stein and Silverstein, under my supervision, traded this item for the ten gallons of �26 ice cream. Off hand it would seem that the cost of the ice cream would be 97 ~ center per gallon but that is not true. I do not expect to pay Finkelstein's Inc. for this item of merchandise, and as a stockholder in said corporation I have instructed them to charge the account off as a loss. They will not lose the $9.75 as the wholesale cost is less than this amount and furthermore they can deduct the loss from their income tax returns. After much scientific calculation I ti nd that my stock i n Finkelstein's Inc . has decreased in value 83 cents therefore the cost of the ice cream to me was 8 3/10 cents per gallon . ***** ... ***'**'**** Assorted Duties : chopping down trees digging a well hauling poles hauling fire wood hauling coal fighting forest fires sorti ng merchandise at warehouse sorting salvage merchandise smashing tin cans h auling water finance clerk detail clerk runner for headquarters stacking lumber pulling weeds and grass cleaning barracks watering trees loading and unloading trucks loading and unloading freight cars loading barracks bags on boats and trucks cleaning hatches on boats latrine orderly painting machinery communications clerk engineering clerk �~ 21 Editor' s Note: At the end of his tour of duty, Leo Finkelstein returned home to Asheville, North Carolina to resume management of Finkelstein's Pawn Shop. Leo recalls meeting Webb Ellis, another Asheville Lion's Club member, on the boat coming back to the United States from the Phillippines. The boat landed in Seattle, Washington the day the war was over with Japan, and they were discharged at Fort Bragg N.C. on September I, 1945. Ten days later Leo and Sylvia Bein were married by a judge in the Harlem section of New York City. In deference to his mother' s wishes, they were again married again by Rabbi Unger in Asheville. Leo and Sylvia, parents of Leo Finkelstein, Jr., a faculty member at Wright State University in Dayton, Ohio, reside at The Summjt Retirement Community in Asheville,~ Leo 9 pianist with "The Sanctimonious Seven" and active member of the Asheville Lion' s Club.~ !t (Z.IE:(Ylrl.IN 5 WA-$ UNTIL f2£C£N-n u ,I � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Leo Finkelstein Papers Description An account of the resource This collection contains materials relating to Leo Finkelstein, resident of Asheville, North Carolina, the Asheville Lions Club, and the Beth Ha-Tephila Cemetery in Asheville. It contains computer discs, notes, scrapbooks, book drafts, correspondence, photographs, programs, fliers, and other materials related Leo Finkelstein, his wife Sylvia, and the Lions Club, Elks Club, and Jewish Community in Asheville, North Carolina. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Finkelstein, Leo, 1905-1998 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Letters from Leo: World War II Correspondence with the Asheville Lion's Club Language A language of the resource English Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 107_03_02_LettersFomLeo_M Description An account of the resource Letters of correspondence between Leo and the Lion's Club in which he describes his military training. He talks about his daily schedule, his comrades, his longing for home, and his new perspective on life. Patricia D. Beaver is editor. Subject The topic of the resource Finkelstein, Leo, 1905-1998 World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Lions Club (Asheville, N.C.) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a title=" In Copyright - Rights-holder(s) Unlocatable or Unidentifiable" href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC-RUU/1.0//" target="_blank"> In Copyright - Rights-holder(s) Unlocatable or Unidentifiable </a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1943 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a title="AC.107 Leo Finkelstein Papers" href="https://appstate-speccoll.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/192" target="_blank"> AC.107 Leo Finkelstein Papers </a> Is Part Of A related resource in which the described resource is physically or logically included. <a title=" Leo Finkelstein Papers" href="https://omeka.library.appstate.edu/collections/show/27" target="_blank"> Leo Finkelstein Papers </a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Extent The size or duration of the resource. 55 pages Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Asheville (N.C.) Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. https://www.geonames.org/4453066/asheville.html Temporal Coverage Temporal characteristics of the resource. 1940s Air Force army Camp Croft corporal duty jungle letters Lions Club Miami Beach military Phillipines poetry Smoky Joe Tishomingo World War II https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/ff9ff5cfbd0cd1b19a97d182b58144dc.pdf 36f5182ad3e2794c9fcc6e0966e3daaa PDF Text Text ������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������ Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Leo Finkelstein Papers Description An account of the resource This collection contains materials relating to Leo Finkelstein, resident of Asheville, North Carolina, the Asheville Lions Club, and the Beth Ha-Tephila Cemetery in Asheville. It contains computer discs, notes, scrapbooks, book drafts, correspondence, photographs, programs, fliers, and other materials related Leo Finkelstein, his wife Sylvia, and the Lions Club, Elks Club, and Jewish Community in Asheville, North Carolina. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Finkelstein, Leo, 1905-1998 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Leo Finkelstein Photograph Album/Scrapbook 2, World War II, 1940s Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1940 Language A language of the resource English Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 107_01_04_PhotoAlbum_02_WWII_1940s Description An account of the resource A scrapbook of letter correspondence between Leo Finkelstein and his friends in Asheville and photos from the war. An article by David Schulman tells about Leo's status as an unofficial historian of Asheville and the significant impact he had on the community. Subject The topic of the resource Finkelstein, Leo, 1905-1998 Finkelstein, Leo, 1905-1998--Photographs Finkelstein, Leo, 1905-1998--Correspondence Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a title=" In Copyright - Rights-holder(s) Unlocatable or Unidentifiable" href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC-RUU/1.0//" target="_blank"> In Copyright - Rights-holder(s) Unlocatable or Unidentifiable </a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a title="AC.107 Leo Finkelstein Papers" href="https://appstate-speccoll.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/192" target="_blank"> AC.107 Leo Finkelstein Papers </a> Is Part Of A related resource in which the described resource is physically or logically included. <a title=" Leo Finkelstein Papers" href="https://omeka.library.appstate.edu/collections/show/27" target="_blank"> Leo Finkelstein Papers </a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Extent The size or duration of the resource. 108 pages Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Asheville (N.C.) Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. https://www.geonames.org/4453066/asheville.html Temporal Coverage Temporal characteristics of the resource. 1940s Air Force B'nai B'rith Beth Ha-Tephila Camp Croft David Schulman letter Letters from Leo Lions Club Notice of Classification photograph The American Jewish Times US Army https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/126a9f95fbcc752ba32ac324fc12b037.pdf 0b82b3f18610087c90335956e8ee21e9 PDF Text Text �������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������������. ,.. ' t l l L l �~ ~ ....l g: ~ )l \~ ; 3 ~ - '· 1 - ' I �. ' • ~ \ ~ ~ d ~~ >I. 3 ~ ::> ~ \[_ \;:\ ~ ./ ~ r ~ ' 2 ' ~ · ~i ~ ~ ~ ~ \ ~~ ~l J /, -~ . ~ t\· J /.. ~ , g ~ ~ ~~~ : \ 4~ ~ . 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' ~ ~ i r ·. . ~ -~ . ~ ~- . ~ 60~ / ~- . . �,~~ ~? I Ji �.~~ ~? �. . . r r- r r- tr rr·rrr r f' r r rr Tr fr fr rrrrrt tr rt �I& i&b; ii "' sn• • v za • *4+AW• 41W'f!!l 1 , �ri I ...-"? •,f '-"::'<• ,..._, t j :\ ....,,-' -,...; ; ....._::,> ' r: ~ ....;..r_:, ...) •· ·1 d -') ___., f .:;: .......) \) -- \ [ \::'":"'- -:;) ..... ' ¢ '~ '~ ~ . '(' \ \: - ·, ,,.. .,j ,_ ''] ...,) '! '":;;\ ~ ' ,,., · ~) ·~ .,\ t- ~ --~ 12) ~ ,j ....... ) ~ .c:::- \ <::....-.) .. ... . "" ~- ::s .~ ~ Q~ . .- j ~(".. ~ - -m ·· · -J . -·~~ � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Leo Finkelstein Papers Description An account of the resource This collection contains materials relating to Leo Finkelstein, resident of Asheville, North Carolina, the Asheville Lions Club, and the Beth Ha-Tephila Cemetery in Asheville. It contains computer discs, notes, scrapbooks, book drafts, correspondence, photographs, programs, fliers, and other materials related Leo Finkelstein, his wife Sylvia, and the Lions Club, Elks Club, and Jewish Community in Asheville, North Carolina. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Finkelstein, Leo, 1905-1998 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Leo Finkelstein's World War II Notes Language A language of the resource English Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 107_01_02_SpiralNotebook_WWII_Notes_M Description An account of the resource Leo Finkelstein's handwritten diary providing an account of when he served in World War II. He gives lively, humorous, and detailed descriptions of his feelings and the places and people he met. His diary includes a lot of poetry as well as prose. Subject The topic of the resource Finkelstein, Leo, 1905-1998--Diaries World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a title=" In Copyright - Rights-holder(s) Unlocatable or Unidentifiable" href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC-RUU/1.0//" target="_blank"> In Copyright - Rights-holder(s) Unlocatable or Unidentifiable </a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF Diaries Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a title="AC.107 Leo Finkelstein Papers" href="https://appstate-speccoll.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/192" target="_blank"> AC.107 Leo Finkelstein Papers </a> Is Part Of A related resource in which the described resource is physically or logically included. <a title=" Leo Finkelstein Papers" href="https://omeka.library.appstate.edu/collections/show/27" target="_blank"> Leo Finkelstein Papers </a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Extent The size or duration of the resource. 202 pages Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Asheville (N.C.) Spatial Coverage Spatial characteristics of the resource. https://www.geonames.org/4453066/asheville.html Air Force basic training comrades corporal diary foxhole furlough letters Miami Beach Phillipine Islands Pisgah poetry Tishomingo Tokyo Rose Uncle Sam World War II https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/10b094578caf2efde14d8577c2a5d8e8.pdf 2200fe825551b661b930a89f70a87fe0 PDF Text Text Lawrence Ryan Ziegler American Military History Dr. Judkin Browning March 13t 11 , 2010 Interview Transcript- Dean Williams, March 1Ot\ 2011 Ryan Ziegler- Alright, this is Ryan Ziegler here with Dean Williams on the 1Oth of March at about 10 past 2. We are in Special Collections of the Carol Grotnes Belk Library, on the 4th floor, and it is only Dean and I that are present here in the interview.( ... ) Mr. Williams, can you please state the branch of the military in which .... in which you served? Dean Williams- I was in the Air Force. RZ- OK. And what rank? DW- Sergeant. RZ- OK. How long where you in? DW- ( ... ) 4 years. RZ- OK. ( ... )Were( .... ) let's see( .... ) were you drafted, or did you enlist? DW- Both. I finished( ... ) My senior year in college I finished my last exam, went to check my mail , and there was my draft notice. And at that point (long pause) I decided( ... ) well some time after that, I decided to enlist in the Air Force rather than go into the Army. RZ- OK. Alright, where were you living at the time? DW- When I was drafted ... ? RZ- Yes. DW- I was in Erskine College in Due West, SC. And I had come up( ... ) I got caught in the first draft lottery, and because I was in college, I still had my deferment. But your deferment was good for one college, and for four years. And so my four years were up, and I had a very low draft number. I think, anything below 100 and you were, you were sure of being drafted, and I think, if I remember correctly, I think my number was 54. RZ- OK. What year was this? DW- 1971. 1 �RZ- 1971. OK.( ... ) Is there any reason that you chose the Air Force? DW- I had several friends who had gone into the Air Force, and( ... ) they felt like( ... ) after( ... ) after talking to them and some other people, that( ... ) the Air Force took better care of its troops than the Army did, out in the field( .... ) so( .... ). RZ- OK. That's a good reason.( ...) Can you say anything about your boot camp or training experiences? DW- It was Basic Training, it wasn't really a boot camp. I forget how long it was, it was supposed to be( ... ) they've( ... ) they have radically changed it, they've lengthened it, and the Air Force now has a combat component in basic training, we did not have that. ( .. .)See, I went in, in October( ... ) no, wait a minute( .. .) in Sep ( .... )first of September( ...) and, by the middle of November, I think I was out of Basic Training. So, it was a lot of time spent marching and drilling, a lot ofPT, a lot of time waiting in line, filling out forms . It was( .... ) a very quick and in-depth induction to military culture. RZ- Alright. OK, so what was your job in the Air Force? DW- I was a Linguist. After Basic Training, I was sent to( ...) the Presidio of Monterey, California, to the Defense Language Institute, where I studied Russian. RZ- OK. How long( ... ) How long where you in that process? DW- Just a little bit less than a year. RZ- OK. And( .. .) Let's see( ... ) How did you( .. .) How did you, I guess, utilize that training? DW- Well.. .. after language school, we went to Goodfellow Air Force Base in Texas, for technical training, and then, I was sent to Turkey to serve as a Linguist ( ....) at a listening post, basically. RZ- OK. Can you say anything about, maybe a couple of your most memorable experiences? DW- Actually, it was pretty boring. The work was very boring, actually( ..... ) memorable experiences, I think the most memorable experience was trying to get used to the( ...) to the schedule. We worked four swing shifts, and then four graveyards in four days, and had three days off, and your body was constantly trying to adjust, and by the last graveyard, we were in pretty bad shape, cause we( ... ) it's hard to sleep during the day and there's always stuff going on. I think that the first set ofmids that I had to work were pretty painful( .... ) but as far as the work goes, it was pretty tedious and pretty boring, it wasn't much( ...) I'm sure some people had exciting things, but we didn't. RZ- (Laugh) Alright. OK( ... ) Let's see( ...) So( ... ) So you were basically listening to people talk in Russian? 2 �DW-Yes. RZ- OK. Well that's pretty cool. DW-Well, I guess it could have been, but( .. .) like I said, it was pretty dull stuff( ... ) I worked with some( ... ) some really good people, and( .. .) made some friends that I've kept up with since the 70' s. And then, probably the most memorable experience was actually living in Turkey. We lived on the economy; I didn't have enough rank at that time to live on base. We found a( ... ) a nice place at the end of one of the towns, and it was quiet and while there were Americans in the ( ...)in the little community, it was mostly Turks. And we found the Turks very hospitable, and the( ... ) where we were living there was( ... ) we were on the Bay oflzmit, so we spent ... we swam until we found out that the base had closed the swimming area( ...) because of contamination in the bay( ...) but then there were mountains and all behind us, so we did a lot of hiking and tracking around in the mountains( ...) we enjoyed that, plus( ... ) everywhere you go in Turkey, there's all this history there( ...) everybody passed through there, the Hittites, the Byzantines, the Romans( ... ) the Seljuk Turks, the Ottoman Turks, the Greeks, so it was( ... ) you know, there were a lot of ruins, but there were still, there were buildings that had incorporated ( ... )like there were Mosques that had Greek Columns in them, supporting the roof, so that was always interesting. Plus the( ...) the food was just( ... ) was just amazing, and for someone who hadn't travelled that much to suddenly be plopped down into such a rich culture was( ...) it was quite an experience. RZ- Alright. Sounds interesting, were you able to keep in touch with your family? DW- Oh, yes( ... ) I was over there 2 1/2 years, but we sent voice tapes, ( ...) this was, of course, pre-email days, so we sent cassette tapes back and forth, lots of pictures and( ... ) we wrote letters and my family were great letter writers, as were my wife's, so there was a lot of communication back and forth. RZ- OK. Let's see( ... ) you said something about- about how people entertain themselves, I guess, but( ... ) in Turkey, great place to travel around, I guess. DW- It was, and it was a fairly inexpensive place to live, and public transportation, while dangerous, was relatively cheap and you could get anywhere in the country. There were( ... ) of course, the big busses that ran between the cities, and then there were the small mini busses that ran to the villages, and then of course taxis. Some people bought cars and I didn't have enough nerve to really drive on( ... ) on Turkish roads, but it was( ... ) it was pretty easy to get around( ... ) and then there were( ... ) of course there were things on base, there was( ... ) there was a movie theater, where( ... ) we had, you know, a different movie every night it was just( ...) there was a base radio station, there was a base bookstore, there was a camera shop, there was an audiohobby shop and guys had a good bit of money and nowhere to spend it, so everybody had just top of the line audio systems, so( ... .) and then, every few months you could put in your what they call morale flights from Turkey to( .. .) I believe they went from( ... ) I don't know if they 3 �flew from our base, or you had to go to Istanbul, but they were flights to Europe, for guys on leave, so( .. .) the service members and the dependents could fly on that flight, so a lot of people went to Europe and travelled on leave. So, there was stuff to do, a lot of people were miserable. It was a hard place for( .... ) if you were single, because of the culture it was( ... ) it was hard there was no( ... ) very little interaction between( .. .) between like American men and Turkish women ( .. .)and, some people were very unhappy there, I think, a lot of guys got married, 18, 19, came over( .. .) divorce rate was pretty high over there, if they had to live on the economy, it was( ... ) it was hard for people without( ... ) I don't know how you say this, life-skills, dealing with a foreign language, dealing with a very different culture, dealing with( ... ) a very different attitude, like for example the town we were in had a water supply, and they'd come around and read your water meter wrong. My water-meter was broke. It was broke when we moved in and it was broke two and a half years later, and I always paid, they had the same water bill, and every time we went to pay the bill, I'd tell the guy that our water meter was- was broke, and he would say "Yes, know it's broke," and the next month, I'd tell him the same thing, so, a lot of people were frustrated by the sort of( ... ) the difference in the attitudes like that, and then it bothered some Americans that the Turks stared at them. Well, of course they would, you know, I mean, just drop foreigners down into your- into a small town and you're going to be stared at, and, I think some of the American customs amazed them, like Christmas trees. But, anyway( .. .) I forget what your question was, I hope I answered it. I kind of wandered off, there. RZ- Well, it was( .. .) it was, lots of information in there, anyways. (Laugh) DW- Sure. RZ- What was your( ... ) what was your experience with officers and fellow soldiers? DW- I had very little contact with officers. We were on-we did shift work, and( ... ) we were isolated from the main base, and there was( ... ) there was a flight commander, usually a lieutenant or a captain (cough) and that was about the only officer I saw on a daily basis, unless I had to go down on Main Base, then of course, it was crawling with officers. So I really didn't have that much contact with( .. .) I did make one friend who was an officer and,( ... ) it was at his own risk that he was friends with me because officers and enlisted men were not supposed to fraternize, of course. But, he and his wife had been on some of the same trips and same places that my wife and I had, so we got to know each other. And we're still- we still keep in touch, in fact( ... ) he's been to see us twice since then( .. .) no three time, since then, so( ... ) And the like I said, I made some real good friends while we were over there, some very interesting people. I met people from all over the country. We had neighbors from, let's see( .. .) one fella was from the Philippines, another was from Texas, one was from Oklahoma, one was from Michigan, so, we were ( .. .) we had a lot of different parts of the country brought together there and, it's like anywhere, some people you like better than others, some people you socialize with, some you don't. So, at work everybody( ... ) well you had to get along, there was no option about that, and then after work you associated with people you liked and avoided those you didn't, so( .. .) 4 �Fortunately, I didn't have to live on base. That was a real plus, I didn't have to live in the barracks. RZ- Yeah, I bet. DW- So I had a( .. .) we had a little place off-base which was nice. So, I avoided a lot of that mess. RZ- Well , that's good. Was it because you were married that.. ... ? DW-Yes. RZ- OK. Alright. Do you think there's a higher( .. .) out of curiosity, do you think it was a higher rate of married guys or single guys? DW- I'd say, there's probably more single guys. RZ-OK DW- I can't say for sure( .. .) I don't really know( ... ) I really don't know( .. ... .. ) probably more single guys. That I encountered. RZ- OK. DW- There was( .. .. ) there was a high school on base that( .. .) dependents from other places, other bases in Turkey were sent there to go to high school. There was also an elementary school and a kindergarten there. So there were a lot of children, American children on the base. RZ- I wouldn't expect that. DW- Oh yes, it was( .. .) and a lot of people had babies while they were there. RZ- Interesting. Well , do you recall your service ending? I guess what I really want to know is, what did you do afterwards? DW- Well, it kind of came to a screeching halt, while we were in Turkey( .. .) Congress was really upset with- with the Turks going into Cyprus, so they passed( ... ) I don't know if it was an embargo, or( .... ) I can't remember exactly the legislation. And so, the Turks closed the base, and they shut down- they shut down our operation, and- and people who had( .. .) a lot of time left on their enlistment were shipped to other bases, and those of us who were .. . had a few months left just stayed there, and they found jobs for us, like I worked at the Post- at the base Post Office for several weeks and then at the base Marina. They just had( ... ) there were so many of us. We worked every other day at the Marina, and the boss, the fella who was working the Marina said, basically if you need days off, just let him know, and take 'em, cause .... we did have stuff to do we had an oil slick move in one night, so we spent a good bit of time cleaning that up from the base beach and shoreline, but,( ... ) anyway, so I ended up basically( ... ) you know( ... ) not doing 5 �(... )well, like I said, you know, working at the Marina, getting boats ready for winter, and then we just- we did a lot of day trips, during that time. And then the Turks took over the base. RZ- OK. What year was that? DW- Seventy-( ..... ) '75 or '76, I cannot... I'd have to look at that. RZ-OK DW-It might have been '76. 1976. RZ- Alright. Did you( ... ) did you go to( ... ) after you got out of the service, did you go( .. .) I guess, go to work somewhere else, or go back to school, or. ... ? DW- I went back to school. I went to( ... ) University ofTennessee on the GI Bill. RZ- OK. What did you study? DW- Library Science. RZ- Library Science. And( ... ) Well, you said that( ...) you said that you've kept in touch with a lot ofthe guys that you served with. DW- Some of them, yes. RZ- OK. Even now? DW-Mm-hmm. RZ- OK. DW- One of them( .... ) one of them from Texas has put up a website with a lot of pictures from when we were in Turkey, and then, somehow a friend of his went back to Turkey just a couple of years ago and took pictures of how the village is( ... ) the town is now. And we're thinking photographs of the base( .. .) since it's a Turkish base, there's no getting on it, of course. But from the hills up above the base, they took some pictures, and you can see some of the changes. The village has really grown. Well, this wasn't a village, it was a small town. But it's just really grown, it's changed a good bit. RZ- What was the name of the village? DW- Karamiirsel. RZ- Karamiirsel? DW- It means "Black Prophet," or "Gloomy Prophet." And while we were there, we had some friends that had a little girl. And she was a beautiful little blonde-headed, cherubic baby, and 6 �they named her "Kara." And the Turkish women were just really upset with them for calling her that, that such a beautiful child would be given( ... ) would be called gloomy or( ... ) or dark. RZ- Interesting. Alright, did you join any veteran's organizations? DW- No, I.. .. No . RZ- OK. And, so, you studied Library Science? DW- I did. RZ-And ( .. .)and you have been a Librarian. DW- I have worked( ... ) I have worked in the Library( .... ) since 1978, I guess. RZ- Alright. I guess( ... ) one of the last things I want to ask is( .. .. ) I guess, how( ... ) how would you say that your service affected your life since then? DW- ( .... )It's had a major impact( .... ) it did a real good job of getting me away from home, getting me out. Definitely out of the comfort zone( ... ) you know, the( .. .) that( ... ) small-town, small-college, living in the same house for years( .... ) exposed me to a( ... ) a very different way of life, a very different mentality and mindset, and people who've never been in the military just don't understand it. ( ... )And( ... ) we( ... ) we were supposed to( ... ) go on a( ... ) we were supposed to go on Flying Status. We were supposed to be( .. .. ) work off an Airborne platform. And( ... ) so they sent us to survival school, so I spent nearly four weeks at( .. .) four weeks( .. .. ) three and a half weeks at Fairchild Air Force Base in Spokane, Washington in December, and that was a real experience. It was( ... ) for me it was a good experience, because I realized how much I could do and, realized what my limits were, and got to see some really different country up there( ... ) the first time I ever saw serious snow like that. And then of course the foreign travel. Of course( ... ) Monterrey, California was just was( .. .) very different from the( ... ) from the East Coast. ( ... ) Learned a lot of discipline. I learned( ... ) we went to school 8 hours a day and then came home and studied anywhere from 4 to 5 hours a night. I learned to appreciate( ... ) a lot of things. And then( .... .) and of course the foreign travel. We had( ... ) we had guys that desperately fought( ... ) well, didn't fight, but did not want to go overseas, and I was terrified I'd get stationed somewhere in the States, but, I was glad to get Turkey. So, it worked out really well , but no, it was a very ( .. .. )for me, it was a very positive experience. Like, I said it was( ... ) you know( .. .) I don't know that I would have joined, ifl had- .. .well , I might have, given the( ... ) given the employment situation, at that time, but the draft certainly pushed me into it, and so I went ahead and joined the Air Force, so .... But, like I said, it was( ... ) it was an interesting experience. RZ- Sounds like it. Well, before we conclude the interview, is there anything else that you'd like to add, any ..... ? DW- I can't think of anything else( ... ) 7 �RZ- Alright. Well thanks for doing this interview. DW- (Laughs) You're welcome. RZ- And, I guess that concludes this interview. DW- Is that what you needed? (Recorder shuts off) 8 � https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/b2b6d2837e402d746342fdc38358209e.mp3 3143d3ce02ee204bf4f17c8b8374484a Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Description An account of the resource Dean Williams describes his service as a Russian linguist working in Karamursel, Turkey. He was drafted after he finished his undergraduate degree, spent a year in Monterrey, California, studying Russian and then was sent overseas. He describes the work as "boring" but living in Turkey expanded his mind and allowed him to see from a different perspective. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Appalachian State University American Military History Course Veterans Oral History Project Description An account of the resource Each semester, the students of the American Military History Course at Appalachian State University conduct interviews with military veterans and record their military experiences in order to create an archive of oral history interviews that are publicly accessible to researchers. The oral histories are permanently available in the Appalachian State University Special Collections. The project is supervised by Dr. Judkin Browning, Associate Professor of History at Appalachian State University and all interviews are transcribed by the student interviewers. Copyright Notice: Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project’s audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used (e.g. Veterans Oral History Project, University Archives and Records, Special Collections, Appalachian State University, Boone, NC). Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed. Williams, Dean Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview. Ziegler, Ziegler Interview Date 3/10/2010 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 0:26:54 File name 2013_063_Williams_Dean_interview 2013_063_Williams_Dean_transcript Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Dean Williams, 10 March 2010 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Ziegler, Ryan Williams, Dean Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a title="UA.5018. American Military History Course Records" href="https://appstate-speccoll.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/167" target="_blank">UA.5018. American Military History Course Records</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project's audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used. Extent The size or duration of the resource. 8 pages Language A language of the resource English English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Subject The topic of the resource Vietnam War, 1961-1975 Veterans Williams, Dean United States Interviews Personal narratives, American Description An account of the resource Dean Williams describes his service in the Air Force as a Russian linguist working in Turkey. He was drafted after he finished his undergraduate degree, studied Russian in Monterey, California for a year, and was then shipped overseas. He describes his work as "boring" but living in the small town of Karamursel was eye-opening and a very positive experience. Air Force basic training Cyprus Dean Williams Erskine College Karamursel linguistics Monterey California Russian sergeant Turkey https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/016ad9b4879f4bba6acb5247cbb5dcb2.pdf 3358cf76746340071551dc9b982fd3fb PDF Text Text Paul Borowicz HIS 3823-101 Transcript of Oral History Interview with Ken Shabhaz. March 13th, 2011 Greensboro, NC Borowicz: So, you were in the Air Force, correct? Shabhaz: Yes, I was in the Air Force from 1968 to 1973. Borowicz: Okay, just for the record, we're interviewing Ken Shabhaz. It's March 13 1\ and we're in his office in Greensboro, NC. As he stated, he was in the Air Force from 1968 to 1973. Shabhaz: Yes, '68 to '73. Borowicz: So, roughly, the end of the Vietnam war era? Shabhaz: Exactly. Borowicz: Okay, were you drafted or did you enlist? Shabhaz: I had four draft notices, and went with the Air Force. Borowicz: So, weren't drafted by the Air Force? Shabhaz: Well, the army drafts you, but I was trying to get into the Navy. The Air Force had openings first, so I ended up in the Air Force. Borowicz: Okay. Shabhaz: My two armed guards took me to my last physical, or else they would have put me in the Marines. Borowicz: Oh yeah, I would have gone for the Navy as well. Where was the farthest you were stationed from home? Shabhaz: The farthest from home was Sacramento. Borowicz: So, that was nice that you got to stay in the country. Shabhaz: I got to stay in the country in the middle of the Vietnam war, so it was great. Borowicz: What were your duties during that time? I know you dealt with money and payroll at some point. Shabhaz: Well, at first they tried to make a navigator of me, then a pilot out of me, but they were unsuccessful there, so I ended up a supply officer. I was stationed at Montgomery, Alabama for most of my tour, where I was the base supply officer. Borowicz: What did that entail? Shabhaz: Well, the base supply officer was in charge of anything that was expendable, so all the parts and pieces that go on at an Air Force base, other that the furniture and equipment, I was responsible for. Borowicz: So, what kind of rank do you get for that? Shabhaz: Well, in the Air Force, it was a matter of so long of a period of time, so when I went in, I was a Second Lieutenant. I did the 90 day "wonder crash course" at San Antonio. Borowicz: What's that? Shabhaz: Well, that's the basic training for officers. Officers have a couple of routes. Sometimes, folks are in ROTC or some other activity, but otherwise, they have a basic training that's 90 days, and you come out a Second Lieutenant. That' s the route I ended up going, in the middle of winter, in San Antonio, Texas. Borowicz: Had you already had a college degree before that? �Paul Borowicz HIS 3823-101 Shabhaz: Yes. Generally, at that point you had to have a college degree, so I had already graduated. And, as I said, I already had a couple of draft notices, so I was picking and choosing where I was going to end up. Borowicz: I remember you telling me a story when I think you were in charge of payroll or something ....... when you counted money so long one day, ---Shabhaz: Well, yeah. A lot of interesting things happened. I ended up with special duty and we had to give a surprise cash count, and it was the day they did payroll at the finance office. I was a finance officer, so they wanted me to go in there and count the money. Generally, at that time, they paid most of the military in cash. So, there was seven million dollars in cash in small denominations, that me and two other NCO ' s counted for three hours, and sat there and thumbed through cash. Borowicz: Wow! That's a lot of cash. I had remembered that you said your fingers turned green after awhile. Shabhaz: Yeah, fingers and hands turned green from handling all that money, and besides that, we had a lot of angry people waiting for their paychecks. Borowicz: Now, did you have to go through the regular boot camp as well, for regular training? Shabhaz: No, no training for the officers was kind of the same, similar objectives as the basic training of the enlisted but, how do I say this, kind of more book learning kind of stuff rather that the physical stuff. The Air Force was by far one of the better ones to choose, at that time anyway. Borowicz: So, more of classes than training? Shabhaz: Yeah, classrooms and more of management type things, and how the Air Force and the military is structured. It' s kind of general information. It kept us kind ofbusy. On the drill pad, we spent one or two hours a day. That was always lots of fun. Borowicz: That's one of the things I never understood, the formation drillings. It doesn' t seem to -----Shabhaz: Well, the idea there is basically discipline. Borowicz: Obedience? Shabhaz: Yeah, it's a kind of discipline working as a unit. As officers, we took turns leading the group. Ifthis was an enlisted group, they' d never be leading the group, so we ended up taking turns to lead and march a whole squad. I don't remember how many guys were in it but, when you turned around and saw a lot of people coming at you, right on your heels. Borowicz: So, you said this was in San Antonio? Shabhaz: San Antonio is where I started my basic training. That was 90 days there, then I was scheduled to go into navigator school, which was in Sacramento. So, they gave me a couple of weeks off. I went home for a week or so, and then drove from Detroit to Sacramento and reported out there for navigating school. Borowicz: And you were stationed on Sacramento for most of the war? Shabhaz: No. I spent about nine months there, and didn' t pass navigation school, so I ended up out of navigator school. Then they wanted to send me to pilot school, from the back seat of the F-4 to the front seat of the F-4. I said, "No thanks", and that' s when they decided to send me to Montgomery, Alabama, to be the base supply officer there. �Paul Borowicz HIS 3823-101 Borowicz: What did that entail? Were there a lot of people involved in the war effort in Montgomery, because I feel that most ofthe stuff would be on the West Coast? Shabhaz: Yeah, Montgomery, Alabama was a cushy job to get in the middle of Viet Nam. It was one base, one command. It was the Air War College, basically officers in the Air Force that were the rank of Major, that wanted to become Leutenent or higher, then they basically spent six to nine months there at Maxwell Air Force base to get their master's degree. Most of them ended up getting their master's degree in business administration. So we really didn't have any airplanes assigned to our base, there was over 800 officers there when I got on the base. I had to share my BOQ room for the first two weeks with a one star general cause that was the lowest rank they could find for me to share a room with. So it was a rather unusual place to be. I ended up being in charge of 70 personnel, most of them civilians at that base because once again it wasn;t a heavy war kind of effort. So it was not a bad place to spend the next three years. Borowicz: Doesn't sound bad at all. Shabhaz: No it wasn't, I was most fortunate. I ended up, they sent me to Supply School in Denver, Colorado in the peak of ski season, I'm not a skier but I ended up being the designated driver when we went to the ski resort. So that was an interesting three months there. And shortly after returning from that Linda [his wife] and I got married in april of 1970. Borowicz: Did you meet her in college before? Shabhaz: Yeah, we had met in college and we were engaged. Part of it when you're looking at Vietnam is you're uncertain of where you're going to end up at. But when it looked like I was going to end up at Montgomery, Alabama we decided to get married. Borowicz: So I assume you guys were able to keep in touch pretty well since you were here. Shabhaz: Oh yeah Borowicz: And with your parents and everything? Shabhaz: Yeah, I mean writing. Back then most of it was still written communication, cause telephone was too expensive and the Internet hadn 't come around yet. Borowicz: Yeah no cell phones or anything yet. Shabhaz: No, no cell phones just yet. Borowicz: So most of the stuff, like the supplies, you did on the base, was that for food and uniforms? Like suppliesShabhaz: It covered everything. It covered mechanical parts although we did have a large fleet of aircraft assigned to the base, it was a popular place to get your aircraft repaired. The Air National Guard for example, was real big back then in the South, so some planes would be brought in from out lying areas, because we had the capacity to repair them. Borowicz: I didn't know the National or State Guard had planes. Shabhaz: Oh yeah, the National Guard had planes, cause we were sitting at that time in the South, and a lot of the concern was from Cuba and other places as well. It was a popular place to bring a broken airplane, because we had two of the best golf courses in the country. So, if you had to spend a couple of days in one place, you could always play golf. Borowicz: Yeah, that sounds really nice. What was the food like on the base? �Paul Borowicz HIS 3823-101 Shabhaz: The food, well, for an officer. . .I generally ate at the officer' s club, which was great. It was like going to Greensboro ' s Country Club and having dinner all the time. Borowicz: So, you said the people there were one star generals or above? Shabhaz: Well, they were majors or higher, as far as the officers were concerned. Borowicz: So, most people there were officers? Shabhaz: Well, the majority of the military were officers, and there were a lot of civilians as well. Most of the running of the base was done by civilians. I'm not sure what our population mix was, but we probably only had 25 to 30% military, it was mostly civilians. Then, the air college itself had a lot of military itself, but once again, it was major rank or above. That's what all the Generals were around for, it was basically the teaching. They teach classes, they' d come in and teach maybe a six week period, and then move on to something else. That's why the officers quarters ended up with a lot of Generals in them. Then, once Linda and I got married, we basically moved off base, that' s what we did. So, I had to learn to eat her cooking. Borowicz: You were stationed there for the rest of your service. Shabhaz: Yes, ended up there for three and a half years, so was fortunate that part of the program they offered on the base was from Auburn University, so I signed up for that as well, and ended up taking some of my classes on base and off base. I had so much to do, but managed to go to school full-time and be in the military. Borowicz: Sound like a busy schedule. Shabhaz: It worked out very well. In fact, when the war started to wind down, they wanted to give me an early out, but I said "You can't, I still have a semester left". And at Maxwell, at that point, once again, it was the base that ended up with the prisoners of war, you know, the POW' s, the one' s that finally got released after the war, because once again, it had so many amenities, it was pretty much like a country club. Borowicz: Did you come into contact with any of them, or no? Shabhaz: No. Borowicz: Just a different part of the base? Shabhaz: No, well that happened just after I had gotten out. The war was just ending when I was getting out, and the prisoner release was three to four months after that. Borowicz: So, you said it was a voluntary leave at the end? Shabhaz: Yeah. Borowicz: Just stuck around and got your education? Shabhaz: Right Borowicz: What did you get your degree in from Auburn, did you say? Shabhaz: I ended up with my Masters Degree in Economics, basically. I had gotten my Bachelors Degree from Aquinas College in Business and Accounting, so what they offered was a government administration or business administration kind of classes, so I took those. Borowicz: And you said that, or like when you were released, I guess released was a bad word ... Shabhaz: No, that' s not a bad word. Borowicz: Well, when you were done--Shabhaz: Finished the tour �Paul Borowicz HIS 3823-101 Borowicz: So, when you finished the tour, was it hard for you to go from that kind of life to civilian life, or was it like you already said, you were living offthe base with your wife? Shabhaz: No, the hard part at the time, was that there were a lot of other folks getting out of the military at that time, so it was a job situation. So, we spent the next four months after we got out of the military, traveling around doing job interviews. I got out in, what was it, December, and so we'd find somebody to pay room and board to for a night or two, and we'd travel the South in the middle of winter doing job interviews and ended up in Greensboro, a lot by chance. Borowicz: Well, I'm glad you're here. Shabhaz: Thank-you. Borowicz: Do you still have any close friendships with anyone you served with? Do you keep in contact with anyone? Shabhaz: Well, there was one individual that turned out to be most unusual. I don't know if you remember Father Ken Boyack? Borowicz: No. Shabhaz: He was a Paulist priest, and it turned out that he was stationed in the military at the same time. He was in a different section of the supply area at the same time, in the equipment area, the heavier items. But, it turned out that he and I kind of knew each other, you know, we socialized, but then I don't know, what was it, ten, fifteen years later, he shows up at St. Paul's Catholic Church as a priest. Borowicz: Wow, was he a chaplain in the service? Shabhaz: No, he was just another supply officer in the service, and he decided to become a priest, after or during his service, I'm not sure. I'm not too sure of the situation. But, he's the only one from military service days I've ever kept up with. Borowicz: Where's he at now? Shabhaz: He's up in D.C. We talk when he's down here. We get Christmas cards, and do that kind of stuff. He's in charge of a lot of their outreach programs .... Borowicz: Are you in any Veteran's organization of any type? Shabhaz: No, not really. The Boy Scouts is the closest thing I guess, but I've not maintained any kind of interest in that. Borowicz: Well, I think that's just about it. Thank you so much for your interview tonight. Shabhaz: You're welcome, it was a pleasure. Thank you Paul. � https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/4cee11b31bc5557d53b378fd22c140e6.mp3 037152c569a2e485cee56bbf5cb58bd4 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Appalachian State University American Military History Course Veterans Oral History Project Description An account of the resource Each semester, the students of the American Military History Course at Appalachian State University conduct interviews with military veterans and record their military experiences in order to create an archive of oral history interviews that are publicly accessible to researchers. The oral histories are permanently available in the Appalachian State University Special Collections. The project is supervised by Dr. Judkin Browning, Associate Professor of History at Appalachian State University and all interviews are transcribed by the student interviewers. Copyright Notice: Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project’s audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used (e.g. Veterans Oral History Project, University Archives and Records, Special Collections, Appalachian State University, Boone, NC). Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed. Shabhaz, Ken Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview. Borowicz, Paul Interview Date 3/13/2011 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 0:17:18 File name 2013_063_Shahbaz_Ken_interview 2013_063_Shabhaz_Ken_transcript Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Ken Shabhaz, 13 March 2011 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Borowicz, Paul Shabhaz, Ken Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a title="UA.5018. American Military History Course Records" href="https://appstate-speccoll.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/167" target="_blank">UA.5018. American Military History Course Records</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project's audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used. Extent The size or duration of the resource. 5 pages Language A language of the resource English English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Subject The topic of the resource Vietnam War, 1961-1975 Veterans Shabhaz, Ken Personal narratives, American United States Interviews Description An account of the resource Ken Shabhaz recounts his service in the Air Force as a base supply officer in Montgomery, Alabama. He served for a few years in the Vietnam War and then went back to school for Economics. He never was stationed outside the United States but was moved around to several different cities. Air Force base supply officer Ken Boyack Ken Shabhaz Lieutenant Montgomery National Guard POW US Navy https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/0a55ed086ce545d8fce337b4ad4fe441.pdf 30940dfb4580bec433fb3e698d8ae303 PDF Text Text Transcript of Oral History Interview with Frank Guy. March 8, 2010. Statesville, NC Will Dulin: We are at the Troutman and Associates Electrical Contractors Incorporated. My name is Will Dulin and I am interviewing Frank Guy for Dr. Judkin Browning's American Military History course at Appalachian State University. Where were you born and raised? Frank Guy: I was born in Statesville, North Carolina, Iredell County and I was raised here also, went to South Iredell High School and then was drafted into the Army. Dulin: Oh ok. I guess I should have started, when were you born? Guy: November 14, 1951. Dulin: Alright. And after high school, what did you do? Guy: I worked at a machine shop for approximately a year and then about 11 months after graduation I was drafted in to the U.S. Army. Dulin: Ok. So then you went into Vietnam? Guy: Right. I was sent to Fort Jackson for training ... basic training and also took my AIT ... advanced training ... AIT ... Advanced Individual Training at Fort Jackson, South Carolina. And after that I was assigned to leave for Vietnam. Dulin: Ok. And what job were you assigned? Guy: I was in mortars .. .! was ... my MOS was 11C, which is a 81milimeter mortar. Dulin: Ok. And what was your rank starting in and out? Guy: I was of course I was an E1 when I went in and I achieved the rank of PVC and I was up for E4, but the orders never caught up with me before I was discharged. So I was discharged as a PFC ... Private First Class. Dulin: Oh ok. What about your boot camp training experience? How was that? Guy: That was at Fort Jackson. It was very hot, very arduous. Dulin: And then after that you were sent to Vietnam? Guy: I took advanced training at Fort Jackson also after boot camp, when I was assigned ... after boot camp you're assigned what you're going to do in the army, and that �was 11 ... They called it 11 Charlie, which was a 81 millimeter mortar, and I trained on it for 6 weeks, at Fort Jackson also. Then I was sent to Vietnam, after a leave at home. Dulin: What ... when you arrived in Vietnam ... What did you ... What were your first thoughts as far as that? Guy: My first thoughts was, Oh my God, I guess. [Dulin and Guy laugh] What have I got myself into. I stepped off the plane and it was like somebody throwing a very wet, hot, smelly blanket over ... over your whole being. It was extremely humid. I think the temperature was around 108 ... extremely humid, and the odor was almost ... overcame me. It was something I had never smelled before it was extremely offensive ... and ... first impression was not good. Dulin: Right. Lets see ... were you in any combat ... experiences. Guy: Yes. For the first three months, I was over there I was ... what they call, out in the bush. That was ... we would go out in a 12 man crew ... helicoptered out. .. choppered out, and ... we would land in a usually an abandoned rice patty, which was severed as the LZ ... your landing zone and .. .I was in ... one small fireflght and ... that would ... but I was in harm's way the whole ... for the first three or four ... well the whole time I was over there I was in harm's way, but the ftrst three ... three and a half months I was actually out on patrols and could've engaged the enemy at any time. Dulin: What ... do you have any memorable experiences ... that ... that stick out? Guy: Well yeah the memorable experience was on my like second mission out ... we were contacted by headquarters platoon, which was approximately a half a mile from our position. They said they were 3 Vietnamese, Vietcong ... headed down the creek toward us, and we set up a perimeter on that ... or line on that creek and as they approached, I was assistant gunner on the M60 machine gun, which meant I was laying in the only opening in the brush, and I held the ammunition up in my hands ... and when the ... the guy fired the ... our sergeant told us to just let the M60 ... mow them down more less is what he said. And when ... they pulled the trigger on the M60 machine gun it fired one round and jammed. And there I was laying in an opening ... and the Vietcong immediately swung around. I was the first one he seen, and my whole life flashed before my eyes as ... as .. .I just knew I was gonna die. And ... my buddy with opened up 3 M16s and mowed them down. We killed 2 of them and one of them run off and we never saw him again. Dulin: Right. Guy: That was my most memorable experience and my most terrifying experience all rolled into one. Dulin: And ... how ... how long were you over there? Guy: I was over there 8 and a half months. �Dulin: Eight and a half months? Guy: Mhmm. Dulin: Did you have any awards or medals or ... ? Guy: I got the Combat Infantry Badge, which ... cm ... which was in .. .isjust a letting you know that you were in combat. Dulin: Right. Guy: That's the Vietnam Campaign ribbon and that's ... that's what I got. Dulin: How did you stay in touch with your family while you were over there? Guy: By mail. Dulin: By mail? Guy: Mostly and ... we were ... when I was in the rear area ... sometimes I was allowed to call them ... made probably: .. probably a total of three phone calls· home. And of course there was 12 hours difference in the time so ... if I called them at noon it was midnight here. I found that out when I called in the afternoon from there and it was 2 or 3 o'clock in the morning here. Dulin: Right ... Did you ... were there ... were there any types of entertainment ... in Vietnam? Guy: Yes ... Very sparse ... very sparse. Some ofthe rear areas had ... EM clubs, which was the Enlisted Mens clubs, and they had ... they did their best to entertain us. They would have the Vietnamese locals had little rock bands. Dulin: Mhmm. Guy: You couldn't really understand what they were saying, but they made a noise and it was entertaining. We had ... when I was stationed in one place the Air Force Base was in close proximity and I enjoyed the chapel annex there. They had a nice chapel and they had a annex behind it, which was air conditioned ... had the pool tables and refreshments available and that was the ... the most enjoyable time I guess ... but that was ... that was short lived. Dulin: Did u keep any .. .like a personal diary or ... ? Guy: No I did not I regret that. I wish I hadda, but I did not. �Dulin: And do you remember ... when you were ... I guess when you were on the flight over back to the United States, as far as being discharged or ... being sent home. Do you remember that? Guy: I do. I remember it very vividly ... We left the Benwah air base and ... we left under small arms fue. Dulin: Mhmm. Guy: And the ... pilot. . .it was a commercial air liner. But I did not know a commercial air liner could do what it did .. .he ... he layed that thing over on its side and ... and ... pulled the nose up ... till it almost stalled ... and cause we were ... were under fue so. We left ... once we got the altitude I was very relieved. Dulin: Right. Guy: Very happy. Dulin: What were your ... I guess your parents or ... or siblings reactions when you came home? Guy: [Laughs] That's a funny story. I was ... as I said I didn't pull a full year. The tours then were a year and I come home in 8 and a half months and ... when I landed in . .. we ... we'd in processed out in Fort Dix, New Jersey and I did not know until that very moment that I would be getting out of the army. I figured I'd serve the rest of my 11 ... 10 and a half... II months in the United States .... and a guy looked at my ... looked at my records and he looked back up at me and he looked back down at records ... said I am not believing this ... this is a biggest drop out ofthe army, said by Guy you're going home ... [Laughs] And he ... then he asked me ifl wanted to ... keep processing out or ifl wanted to get a bunk for the night ... and this I'd already been up at that time for about three days without any sleep, and I said lets keep processing ... cause I was afraid they'd find out their mistake ... [Laughs] ... Dulin: Mhmm Guy: ... and I'd be reassigned to a base here in the United States so .. .I was very surprised. I called home, told my daddy, and he didn't believe me. He thought I'd done something wrong, messed up ... Dulin: Mhmm. Guy: .. .I was getting kicked out of the army, not .. .trying to swear .. .I swore to him that it wasn't. He ... his reaction was ... my family was relief and jubilation. Dulin: Right. �Guy: Very Happy. Dulin: After .. . after that ... did you ... want tomake ... career out of the military? Guy: Absolutely not. Dulin: Not. Guy: [Laughs] No. On hindsight I wish maybe I hadda but .. .at that time in my life absolutely not. I was wantin to get home and get back on with my life. Dulin: Let' s see ... How .. .How did your service experience affect your view on the military or your life in general? Guy: . .. My .. .if affected my view on the military in a .. .I think a positive way. I know what at this time in my life I know what these soldiers are going through and all the conflicts around the world now .. . and it .. . it gave me a great appreciation for the military for ... for the fighting man and ... and it made my grow up. My .. .my military experience .. .I went in as a high school kid and I come out as a man. And .. .I do not regret it. I would do it again but .. . as I stated earlier, I was drafted: I didnot volunteer, but .. .I never had any thoughts other than to go and serve my country and do it and do it to the best of my ability. Dulin: Is there anything else you would like to say? Guy: .. .Just that .. .I' m proud of my service. I'm proud I did it. I was drafted... but I fulfilled my service and as I said I would do it again. And . . .I just .. .it .. .it bothers me when . .. bothered me greatly that we were not welcomed home with open arms. Vietnam era veterans are ...were looked down upon and that really bothered me a lot in my early years, but I've learned .. . and to .. .I've overcame that and ... the ROTC at West Iredell High School had ... had honored the veterans 2 or 3 years ago ... and that's the first time, after I returned home from Vietnam, that I received any thanks or any honor from any organization and that meant a lot to me. And .. .I just think the Vietnam veterans ... they ... they earned and need as much respect as any other veterans have .. .have been awarded and . .. the Vietnam Wall come through here. I went and seen it. The traveling wall. .. and it sent ... sent chills up my back. I seen some buddies names on there and I just feeLthat I'm one of the very very fortunate ones. I made it back with all my. parts and pieces in tact and the real heroes are the ones that didn' t return and gave their life and I just feel very thankful to God that 1.. .I returned in one piece. Dulin: Well thank you for the interview. Guy: Well you' re .welcome. Thank you for interviewing me. � https://omeka-test.library.appstate.edu/files/original/410fc99a45bea93058f7ebd1eb8369bd.mp3 e04f8171fffb03455b623d7b1199ea55 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Appalachian State University American Military History Course Veterans Oral History Project Description An account of the resource Each semester, the students of the American Military History Course at Appalachian State University conduct interviews with military veterans and record their military experiences in order to create an archive of oral history interviews that are publicly accessible to researchers. The oral histories are permanently available in the Appalachian State University Special Collections. The project is supervised by Dr. Judkin Browning, Associate Professor of History at Appalachian State University and all interviews are transcribed by the student interviewers. Copyright Notice: Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project’s audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used (e.g. Veterans Oral History Project, University Archives and Records, Special Collections, Appalachian State University, Boone, NC). Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed. Guy, Frank Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview. Dulin, Will Interview Date 3/8/10 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 0:14:19 File name 2013_063_Guy_FrankW_interview 2013_063_Guy_Frank_transcript Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Frank Guy, 8 March 2010 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Dulin, Will Guy, Frank Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a title="UA.5018. American Military History Course Records" href="https://appstate-speccoll.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/167" target="_blank">UA.5018. American Military History Course Records</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource Copyright for the Veterans Oral History Project's audio and transcripts is held by Appalachian State University. These materials are available for free personal, non-commercial, and educational use, provided that proper citation is used. Extent The size or duration of the resource. 5 pages Language A language of the resource English English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Subject The topic of the resource Guy, Frank Vietnam War, 1961-1975 Veterans Personal narratives, American United States Interviews Description An account of the resource Frank Guy was drafted during the Vietnam War and served 8 and a half months. He was in direct combat and had a couple of near-death experiences. He got out of his service surprisingly early, and he was relieved and had no desire to stay in the military or make a career out of it. Despite that, he values his time in the military and says he would not trade the experience for anything. He wishes the Vietnam veterans had been welcomed more warmly when the returned to the States. Air Force Benwah Fort Jackson mortar Vietnam